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My Pastor says…We have the Holy Spirit…we don’t need the Law of Moses

September 9, 2007

 In the book of Acts.  (Acts 15:19-21) we see an interesting decision made by the disciples concerning non-Jews who have turned to the God of Israel. They send instructions for these new believers to “abstain from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, (which can only be defined in the Torah) from things strangled, and from blood”.  Is this all that is required  for “new testament” Believers?  Are these the only instructions we need to abide by as Christians today?  Of course not.  In fact we don’t even find a prohibition of murder listed in these instructions from James.  So what’s going on?

 The answer lies in the very next verse… “For Moses has had throughout many generations those who preach him in every city, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath.”  Did you catch it? The Disciples are rightly expecting these new Believers, although they have the Holy Spirit to guide them,  to study, learn and apply the Torah, God’s instructions to their lives. In time, they would learn how to live as children of the God of Israel. They would learn about clean and unclean, they would learn God’s definition of food and to abstain from eating the abominable.  They would learn about His Sabbath’s and appointed times.  They would learn to treat others, as they themselves would want to be treated. They would learn Torah, the instructions of a loving Father, given to His children.

  What about us? Has anything changed? Are we under a “new” “new testament” teaching of some kind, or might the words of James still apply to us?   Friends, the Holy Spirit authored the Law of Moses!   May all the redeemed of Israel, return to the ancient paths and once again walk according to His Word, His Torah.    I charge you therefore before God and the Lord Jesus Christ, who will judge the living and the dead at His appearing and His kingdom: Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season.  Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching.  For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables”.  2 Timothy, 4:1-4 

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12 comments

  1. I beg you to pray prior to reading God’s Holy Word from the Bible. Yes Christ has come to abolish The Law of Moses, correct but Do you understand God’s actual Character? Do you know the law of Moses was so difficult for any Jewish person to uphold? But Christ came to abolish only what The Law of Moses said, not what God has done said or taught. god does not change He is consistent through out the entire Bible.

    Basic understanding of the bible comes from the Bible itself. Men can say what they want even I can to But through Christ Jesus the Word this holds only what is Truth!

    The Ten commandments still stand today as always, Christ has given Grace but look to a higher expectation than Man thinks. The law discovers the disease. The gospel gives the remedy.
    Either sin is with you, lying on your shoulders, or it is lying on Christ, the Lamb of God. Now if it is lying on your back, you are lost; but if it is resting on Christ, you are free, and you will be saved.
    Repentance Must be done by most daily at least.


  2. Thank you and may God bless you for your concern for me. I assure you I have prayed much concerning the comments and teachings I have here. I did not arrive at these conclusions without much study and prayer. That said…I welcome your Scriptural guidance as I do not claim to know it all. I constantly urge people to check out what I say…and show me if I am wrong. I would ask however, that you give me chapter and verse as you do so.

    I also want to assure you again as you will see in my writings…that I am saved 100% by the grace of God thru faith in what Jesus (Yeshua) did for me on the cross…I could never earn my salvation. Amazing Grace…how sweet the sound…

    Jesus made it clear in Matthew 5:17-19 that NONE of the Torah, the Law of Moses would be done away with. He said that until heaven and earth passed away…not one jot nor tittle would pass away from the law. He also warned us in those verses about teaching men otherwise, which many pastors continue to do today. Christianity does not like to hear this because Christianity as a whole has made the mistake of our forefathers and strayed far from doing what the Word of God says. Am I wrong?

    Cocnerning the difficulty of keeping God’s commandments…Scripture says something contrary to your opinion. 1John 5:3 says (notice this is new testament by the way…) “For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome.” For instance…Honoring and keeping the 7th day Sabbath is not a burden. It is a blessing each week for my family.

    It would seem we agree that the 10 commandments still stand…and we agree that God does not change…we also agree that man’s opinion means nothing compared to God’s Word. Question…what exactly am I teaching that you think is in error? The part about obeying God’s commandments…or the part about being saved by grace? If you have read my writings they can be summed in “Trust and Obey”. Please feel free to clarify and I will respond as I can.

    May God bless you as you study. Newcolors


  3. Um the Law of Moses (the Torah) is gone, due to Christs reserection, the actual ten commands will always stand. The Holy Spirit writes this in our hearts to obey the ten, as best as we can while in the flesh. It is not till we are Born again that we cannot sin. Born again means born with Christ at His coming. I hope this comes clear to everyone as they read God’s word. without any influence from me or any other religion. It shall come to you from His Spirit and His word.

    I pray it does,
    God Bless, May His peace and Love remain with you always.

    R.D.


  4. Question…Why just the Ten? The Bible never says that He will write just the “Ten Commandments” on our hearts. That is a tradition of your religion…an opinion of man. If not…what about the command to abstain from bestiality? It’s never found in the “New Testament” Is it not true in fact…that sexual immorality can only be Scripturally defined from Torah…the Law of Moses? Again…Our Master said to not to think as you do.(Matthew 5:17) This comes not from my mouth or from my “religion”. Instead it comes from the very Word of God Himself…Messiah… spoken in Matthew 5:17-19. We should take His words very seriously, as He warns us in this passage not to do as you are doing now…teaching people that even the least of the Commandments would be done away with. I would encourage you to read it once more for yourself…and then tell me what you think He means.

    Paul as well you might remember, told us that ALL Scripture was given for instruction in righteousness…not just the Ten Commandments. DO you know that when Paul spoke these words to Timothy in 2Timothy 3:16….there was no “New” testament? The Torah was the very Word that our Master taught from…along with Paul and the disciples. They did not teach contrary to the Bible they loved. They kept Sabbath…they kept the dietary laws…and they kept the Appointed Times of God. And Jesus told them to make disciples of of all the nations. That means that we should be walking out our faith as He did. Right?

    “By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His Commandments. For this is the love of God, that we keep His Commandments. And His Commandments are not burdensome”. 1John 5:2-3
    God bless, Newcolors


  5. The OT is the NT concealed. The NT is the OT revealed. One is no good without the other.

    In Deut 8:03 Moses tells us that “Man does not live by bread alone but by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of the LORD. Matt 4:04 Yeshua (speaking to Satan) says “It is Written, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God.” It is written where? IN THE TORAH!

    John 5:46,47-(this is Yeshua (Jesus) speaking) “For had you believed Moses, you would have believed Me for he wrote of ME. (47) But if you believe not his writtings, how shall you believe MY words?”

    Romans 7:07 Paul states “What shall we say then? Is the Law sin? God forbid! No, I have not known sin but by the Law: for I had not known lust, except the Law had said, you shall not covet.”

    Proverbs 28:09 It states “He that turns away his ear from hearing the Law, even his prayer shall be abomination.

    Isaiah 40:08- “The grass withers, the flower fades:
    but the WORD of our GOD shall stand forever.” Also see I Peter 1:24,25.

    Rev 12:17 ….Which kept the Commandments of GOD AND the TESTIMONY of Jesus Christ.

    Rev 14:12-“Here are the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the Commandment of GOD AND the Faith of Jesus.”

    As far as the Law being too hard to keep. God is an all knowing God. He would not give us laws, rules or commandments that we could not keep. The problem was and still is man’s pride and disobedience. He wants to serve God in his own way and in his own time as he feels the need. I myself do not see where the laws are that hard. Maybe if we worked at keeping God’s laws we wouldn’t have the problems we have. We would have less time and energy to get into the things of Satan.


  6. Matthew 5:17 is a conditional statement.

    The Law will remain unchanged until the end of the world ONLY IF Jesus does not fulfill all the things that were written about him in the Law, the Psalms, and the Prophets.

    Jesus is on record as affirming that he did in fact fulfill all things. And once fulfilled, those things of old have been properly set aside in favor of the new, better, and saving covenant based on the grace and mercy of Jesus Christ.

    The authentic, universal New Covenant Church … the Catholic Church … remains the sole Christian governing authority until Jesus comes again, at the end of the age.

    And indeed, it was the Catholic Church that readopted the the old commandments, preserving their spirit, without their condemnation, and readapted the old commandments into a salvific component of God’s new covenant plan of grace, peace, and salvation. Not through the keeping of any law, but through the superabundant grace and tender mercies of God, according to the work, worship, sacraments, and devotions of the only Church that Jesus ever founded, authorized, empowered, and eternally guaranteed, for the purpose of our salvation … the Catholic Church.

    Anyone who attempts to frame their Christian beliefs in any other fashion is bound to run into insurmountable logical and theological barriers. And rightly so.


  7. douglawrence,

    Thanks for commenting. I apprecieate your taking the time. I of course disagree with much of what you said. First of all,concerning Matthew 5… I guess I am a bit uncertain how you can say that all things have been fulfilled. Messiah has not returned to gather the two houses of Israel into one for instance…many prophecies are yet to be witnessed by you and I as we await His return. Jesus made it very plain…DO NOT THINK…no matter what theologians might say…DO NOT THINK…no matter how many degrees they may have…DO NOT THINK that even one jot of the Torah would be done away with as long as heaven and earth are here. As you must know…if you continue reading Matthew 5, Jesus warns us about teaching people contrary to these very Words concerning the Torah…which you seem to be in danger of doing here.

    You mention the “authentic, universal New Covenant Church”…Have you read in Scripture about the “New Covenant Church”? According to Scripture…the New covenant is given only to the two houses of Israel…The Torah is not done away with but written on our hearts…and can’t be in effect yet…as we still have to teach people to “know the Lord”. You can see for yourself if you read Hebrews 8:7-13.

    So then…if the “New Covenent Church” is the sole governing authority as you say…I would assume we should be living according to Torah which was given to Israel as a light to the nations. The Torah is our foundation for all docrine according to Paul in 2 Timothy 3:16.

    As far as the Catholic Church readopting the Torah etc…for instance,it seems to me that it was the catholic Church that has rejected all of God’s Appointed Times and substituted them for pagan holidays which are an abomination to God according to Scripture. They have attempted to “change the times” walking in the sins of Jeroboam to this day.

    As far as running into “insurmountable logical and theological barriers” you have a point…sort of. When a Believer in Messiah reads 1John 5:3 for example…a choice has to be made…but the only barrier present is one of flesh. Do I obey…or will I disobey and attempt to justify my disobedience by telling the world “I have the authority to change Scripture…I am a Catholic.

    For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome. 1John 5:3

    Newcolors


  8. Newcolors,

    I totally agree with you… not all things have been fulfilled yet. Rapture and Jesus’ second coming still need to be fulfilled. The wedding of Christ and his church still need to be fulfilled. The great tribulation still needs to be fulfilled.

    As a former Catholic, and after much research I have to agree with you too… they have changed many things, such as adding many rituals and traditions that need to be followed. For one they do not read straight out of the bible during mass, they read from a mass book which is not the same thing. They have sacraments to be followed such as infant baptism, holy communion, confirmation…etc. When scripture just mentions baptism (full immersion) and the Lord’s supper that should be done until he returns. Baptism is done once a person accepts Christ as their savior… why does an infant need to be baptized when they don’t know anything yet… they are not accountable to their sins yet, so if they die.. they go to heaven not to Limbo as the Catholic church once believed (they have done away with Limbo recently… hmm I wonder why? maybe because it’s not supported in scripture?)

    I have done so much study and I truly believe we are to keep God’s commandments to the best of our ability until he calls us home. We are saved by grace, but as Christians we must live as Christ did. Though we will still sin occassionaly, we will feel conviction and repent, this is the process of sanctification. Again this will continue until he comes for his church or calls us home before then.

    As for the holidays… I agree with you there too. Where does it speak of Lent in scripture, or Easter with Egg hunts and candy, I have learned that the Feasts of God are the appointed times we need to participate in. They explain God’s plan of redemption from the very beginning of time, thru the cruxifiction and resurrection to His second coming. How wonderful for God to show us so much in his Word. How sad that so many have veils over their eyes and are unable to see these connections. It’s there for all to see, all they need to do is ask God to show them and with an open heart receive it.

    Thank you newcolors! Hang in there – you are doing what God is leading you to do!

    Carly


  9. Thanks Carly…

    I am so glad that the Lord has opened your eyes. It would seem that God has blessed your williness to study His Word! I encourage you to keep right on doing what you are doing. I must tell you that the road you are on won’t be easy all the time…there will be a cost…but we were instructed to count the cost before we decide to follow our Messiah and walk as He walked. If you ever have any questions feel free to ask.

    I wish all Christians could hear and understand what you said…”saved by grace…live as Christ did”…that sums it up pretty well.

    God bless…Newcolors


  10. Jesus had to tell the apostles the same thing I’m trying to point out to those who still insist that keeping the old law … ANY of it … is somehow mandated by scripture:

    Luk 24:44 And he said to them: These are the words which I spoke to you while I was yet with you, that all things must needs be fulfilled which are written in the law of Moses and in the prophets and in the psalms, concerning me.
    Luk 24:45 Then he opened their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures.
    Luk 24:46 And he said to them: Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer and to rise again from the dead, the third day:
    Luk 24:47 And that penance and remission of sins should be preached in his name, unto all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
    Luk 24:48 And you are witnesses of these things.

    At Pentecost, the Church (NOT the Bible) officially replaced the law. Things have never been the same since.

    Thank God!

    These citations and articles explain how all this truly works, for the purpose of our salvation:

    http://douglawrence.wordpress.com/2008/03/29/are-we-christians-still-under-the-law-or-are-we-not/


  11. Doug…thanks for your comment. I am curious however as to whether you checked out my former comments to you. Did you check out the Scriptures I cited concerning the New Covenant? Can you show me from Scripture where the “Church” replaces God’s eternal Commandments as the governing authority in a believer’s life? What do you think John means in 1John 5:3? What does Paul mean in Ephesians 4:17? Does Jesus really not mean what He says in Matthew 5? Has heaven and earth dissappeared?

    As of yet you have answered none of these from Scripture. I do appreciate your interest however and look forward to more conversation with you as you search the Scripture to see if what I say is true or false. That’s all I ask…check it out with a heart to know the truth….instead of just reciting to me what you have been taught.

    Start with this Doug…Share with me what you find from Scripture concerning the New Covenant….1)Who was it given to….2) Does it do away with the Torah…3)Is it in full effect yet? WHAT DOES SCRIPTURE SAY?

    Thanks, Newcolors


  12. What is the purpose of denying the scriptures clearly showing it was ordinances nailed to Yeshuas cross.
    Not the moral law of our Fathers.
    Has to be the devil still has vacancies in the lake of fire.



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