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Chuck Missler’s Sabbath Teaching–An Open Refutation

(The following is an open refutation of Chuck Missler’s teaching on the 7th day Sabbath by myself, Tim C. Terry.  Chuck’s teaching is complete with footnotes etc.  I have just added my comments in blue.  It is my hope that Chuck will reconsider some of his statements in light of Scripture.  God bless, Tim)

THE SEVENTH DAY By Chuck Missler

And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made .  – Genesis 2:3

God set the pattern from the beginning…literally. There is but one day recognized in Scripture as the we ekly Sabbath…the 7th day.

 Remember the Sabbath Day to keep it holy.   –  Exodus 20:8 Many Christians still remain uncomfortable over the issue of the Sabbath day.  Observing Sunday as a memorial of the resurrection of our Lord is our traditional day of worship, and yet many are disturbed over this issue. 

Notice that Chuck Missler correctly states that Sunday is ourtraditional” day of worship.  Whose tradition again? It is a tradition of men.   In fact, with some honest research into the subject you will find (as Chuck alludes to later) that it is a catholic tradition which most of Christianity has latched onto. .  Jesus said “All too well you reject the commandment of God, that you may keep your tradition.  Mark 7:9  Now Chuck says “many” are disturbed over this issue. Why are they disturbed?  Perhaps because “many” know that as Christians we profess to be Bible believers…people who are to line up our very lives with the Word of God.  “If God said it…that settles it”. We proudly tell the world this…yet here… on this issue of Sabbath we stumble backwards into hypocrisy.   That is why many are uncomfortable…it’s because we should repent and won’t.  This always makes someone who is a Believer uncomfortable.  It’s called conviction.   

(Anyone who thinks this is a simple issue to resolve hasn’t studied it very carefully!) 

  Jesus said “If you love Me, keep My commandments”. John 14:15 Don’t be led into thinking this is a complex subject of which only the most learned bible Scholars are able to understand.  Remember…we can always ask WWJD.   Jesus kept the Sabbath…and we are His disciples.  It is really just a simple issue of choosing obedience or disobedience to Scripture.

A number of key questions still remain unresolved for some:o Did God institute the Sabbath just for Israel?

While this may be a key question for some…it is not difficult to resolve.

A mixed multitude went up with them also…Exodus 12:38

“One law shall be for the native-born and for the stranger who dwells among you.” Exodus 12:49  

“But the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God.  In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates.” Exodus 20:10  

“And it shall be, if they (the nations) will learn carefully the ways of My people, (Israel) to swear by My name, “As the LORD lives,’ as they taught My people to swear by Baal, then they shall be established in the midst of My people.  But if they do not obey, I will utterly pluck up and destroy that nation” says the LORD. Jeremiah 12:16-17

Also the sons of the foreigner who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him, and to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—Everyone who keep from defiling the Sabbath, and holds fast My covenant—Even them I will bring to My holy mountain, and make them joyful in My house of prayer.  Their burnt offerings and their sacrifices will be accepted on My altar; For My house shall be called a house of prayer for all nations”. Isaiah 56:6-7

Finally…is not the question irrelevant anyway?  Are we not grafted into Israel thru faith in our Jewish Messiah according to Paul? In fact he says in Galatians 3:29And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise. Perhaps this is why he tells the Gentiles to quit living as Gentiles in Ephesians 4:17!!

o Is a Christian supposed to keep the Ten Commandments?

Isn’t it sad to think this question is even asked within Christianity?  I would like to think that Chuck’s answer to his question is a resounding yes.  Sadly…his answer in this teaching seems to be no.  As you will see he will claim that all of God’s Commandments were done away with by Jesus, having been “nailed to the cross.”

o Does a Christian have to keep the Sabbath? 

Does a Christian have to honor their father and mother? It goes back to whether you believe you should obey God’s Commandments or not.

o When did Sunday replace Saturday as “the holy day”?

Sunday never has replaced Saturday as the day God “set apart” as the Sabbath.  As you will see later…even Chuck agrees with this.

Noah’s Animals?

First, how many of each animal did Noah take into the ark?  Often overlooked is the fact that Noah was to take seven of the “clean” and only two of the “unclean.”1      But how did Noah know which were “clean” and which were “unclean?”  These are ecclesiastical definitions.

This is a good point Chuck makes.  Noah was not “Jewish”.  (Although neither was Abraham or even Moses) Yet it seems that Noah understood quite well the difference between clean and unclean.  It would seem that God Himself set the pattern at creation…long before Sinai just as He did with Sabbath.

It seems that many concepts which were later codified in the Law under Moses had previously been ordained in Eden.2

I agree 100% with Chuck.  In fact, God spoke to Isaac of his father Abraham saying…”because Abraham obeyed My voice and kept My charge, My commandments, My statutes, and My laws.” (Gen 26:5)  As you know, this of course was hundreds of years before Sinai.  Take note of the fact that father Abraham took obedience to God’s commands seriously according to Scripture.

(Notice, too, that Noah was not circumcised and still was able to observe these “Levitical” distinctions.  Abraham, too, was declared righteous prior to his circumcision in Genesis 15:6; circumcision was established in Genesis 17:10ff.  Note also that the priestly instructions linked these concepts with the Sabbath.3 )

Noah was not circumcised because God had not commanded it of him. Also…the instructions given concerning the definition of food…or the Sabbath are not “Levitical distinctions”.  Don’t let Chuck get you off track. As he already said…they were given long before Sinai…long before Levi was ever born.  Circumcision by the way was the sign of the covenant given to Abraham and his descendants. (Genesis 17)  Now, Chuck’s point about Abraham is a good one.  Circumcision never saved anyone and it never will.  But notice…we are talking here about obedience…not justification. I will say it again…our topic is focused on the question of obedience to one of God’s commands…not on how we are declared righteous before the Living God.  This will be important for you to understand as Chuck seems to confuse the two as he attempts to justify his position. Again…keeping Sabbath will not save you…only by the blood of The Lamb, thru faith in Messiah will you be saved. Abraham was circumcised in obedience to God…as Chuck said, he was already saved.  Likewise…at the very least, we as Christians should be obedient to God’s commands out of love for what He has already done for us.  Amen?

The Origin of the Sabbath

Jesus emphasized that:  The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath .  –  Mark 2:27His words point back before the Ten Commandments, to the original purpose and will of God.  The Sabbath came into being when man came into being.  It was set apart and blessed-as a divine example-for the use and benefit of man, at the Creation (Genesis 2:1-3).4

I agree.

First Mention

The first mention of the “Sabbath” (from the Hebrew verb shabbat , meaning “to rest from labor”; the day of rest) is in Exodus 16:23, regarding the gathering of manna:And he said unto them, This is that which the LORD hath said, Tomorrow is the rest of the holy Sabbath unto the LORD: bake that which ye will bake today, and seethe that ye will seethe; and that which remaineth over lay up for you to be kept until the morning .  – Exodus 16:23Notice that this is four chapters before the Law was given at Mt. Sinai.  They were to gather twice as much on the sixth day in anticipation of a day they were apparently already observing.5    It is clear that the Sabbath had been instituted long before the giving of the Law at Sinai:  it was ordained in Eden.

 Good points…

The Decalogue

And, of course, the Sabbath was included in the Ten Commandments:6    Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy.That the Sabbath had been ordained prior to Sinai is even accounted for in the very wording of Exodus 20:8: “Remember…”7 The Sabbath was part of the covenant which God made with Israel at Sinai.8   

 Applicable to All People?

This ordination of the Seventh Day acknowledges the moral duty of man to worship his Creator.9     It also recognizes the basic need of man for a weekly day of rest.  The physical necessities of man require a Sabbath of rest. He is so constituted that his bodily welfare needs at least one day in seven for rest from ordinary labor.  The failure to set aside the seventh day may account for the toll of stress in our modern society.  (It has been reported that an 8% increase/decrease in traffic accidents surround the changes to/from “daylight savings time.”)God even established Himself as the ultimate example.  How can we ignore this day?  If you love God, you need to spend time with Him.  (In contrast to our hectic pace as double-income families, etc.)

While what Chuck has just said might be true…and further builds a good case for keeping the Sabbath…a better reason is that God commanded it. As His children we are to “trust and obey”.  If we love God…we should keep His Commandments according to Jesus.

In Mosaic Legislation

Under the Mosaic law, strict regulations were laid down regarding its observance.10     These were peculiar to that dispensation.  

Just as a reminder…the Mosaic Law was not something Moses just made up. The Mosaic Law is God’s Law… It’s His Word…His Torah…His instructions as given thru the prophet Moses. It’s the foundation of our Bible.  And…it’s eternal.  According to Scripture…the specific instructions given concerning the Sabbath are eternal as well. Exodus 31:16-17 says “Therefore the children of Israel shall keep the Sabbath, to observe the Sabbath throughout their generations as a perpetual covenant.  It is a sign between Me and the children of Israel forever They are not “peculiar to that dispensation” as Chuck says, and he offers no Scriptural evidence to support his position that they were.  In fact, Chuck himself has already pointed out, that the Sabbath was observed before Sinai… it was observed after Sinai and during the Days of Jesus…it was observed after His death and Resurrection….and…it will be observed in the future according to the prophets. (Isaiah 66:23, Ezekiel 46)  That’s a pretty long dispensation.   

Also, and this is very important, the Mosaic Law is what defines sin according to 1John 3:4.  The Mosaic Law is what David referred to as a “Lamp unto my feet… a light unto my path (Psalm 119:105)   We who believe that Jesus is God…must understand then…that Jesus wrote the Torah and He is the Living Torah. He told us concerning His Word in Matthew 24:35 “Heaven and earth will pass away, but My words will by no means pass away”. This definitely includes the 4th Commandment. 

 In the subsequent history of the Jews, frequent references are made to the sanctity of the Sabbath.11   The kindling of a fire on the Sabbath was forbidden.12   The penalty for profaning the Sabbath by doing any work on it was death.13   And yet, the priests still carried on their duties about the Tabernacle.14   The Temple was full of activities.15   The rite of circumcision was performed on the Sabbath if it was the eighth day after the child’s birth.16

Doing good works on the Sabbath is exampled by Jesus in Matthew 12:10-12.  Preserving life…and walking according to Torah is exactly what Jesus did.  It’s what the priests were doing as they carried out God’s instructions concerning the temple and the sacrificial system. They had been commanded of God. It’s what parents were doing by circumcising their sons on the 8th day following birth. These good works neither conflict with nor abrogate the Sabbath Command. In other words it’s okay to obey God on the Sabbath.

In later times they perverted the Sabbath by their traditions.  Isaiah condemned the hypocrisy of the worshipers in his day.17   He defined true Sabbath-keeping as turning from one’s own ways and own pleasures and taking delight in the Lord.18

Chuck makes a good point here…but perhaps not the one he wanted. Consider that Isaiah was not arguing against the validity of the Sabbath Command.  Isaiah was telling people to repent and start honoring the Sabbath as instructed in the Torah.  God’s people had strayed from the Word and so God was calling them back to the Torah thru the prophet Isaiah.  I wonder…what would Isaiah say today about our “Sabbath keeping” or lack thereof?  What would he say about how we have “perverted the Sabbath” by our traditions? “Oh that you had heeded My commandments! Then your peace would have been like a river” Isaiah 48:18

 Other prophets also raised their protests against the abuse of the Sabbath.19   They regarded the destruction of Jerusalem and the captivity of the Jews as due-at least in part-to their desecration of the Sabbath.20   Their 70-year exile in Babylon was directly linked to the Sabbath instructions.21 God clearly takes His instructions for the Sabbath, and Sabbatical years, seriously.

I agree with Chuck here 100%.  God always has…and always will view our transgression of His law as sin. (1John 3:4). Including as Chuck just said…His Sabbath’s. Has God changed?  Not according to Scripture. (Malachi 3:6) 

You can’t legislate devotion.  Even today, in Israel‘s secular state, a visitor is confronted with Sabbath elevators (stopping at every floor during the Sabbath); and other travel inconveniences quite removed from the real intent of the Sabbath observance.

Again…I agree.  Obviously Chuck is right because although God has “legislated” the 7th day Sabbath quite clearly in Scripture for all to keep…most of Christianity has chosen to ignore it as well as actually teach against the need to obey it.     

The New Testament Period

As time passed, the true meaning of the Sabbath had been obscured by the multitude of restrictions laid upon its observance; it had become largely external and formal.  And, of course, as the rules surrounding the observance of the Sabbath multiplied, so did the fanciful and far-fetched rituals to circumvent them.22

Chuck is correct to a point.  There were many “fences” added to protect the sanctity of the Sabbath.   However…what Chuck refers to here is of course “man made traditions.”  Again…don’t get sidetracked.  Keeping the Sabbath is a Commandment of God…not a tradition of men.

It was Jesus’ custom to attend the synagogue on the Sabbath.23     It was inevitable that Jesus would come into conflict with the Jewish leadership over the Sabbath.

The point Chuck just made should be a wake up call for Christianity.  Namely…that it was the custom of Jesus to attend the synagogue “on the Sabbath” (Luke 4:16) Again…as His disciples…we should seek to imitate Him. Amen?  Also…please remember that Jesus had problems with traditions of men which conflicted with the Sabbath Command…not the Sabbath itself.  He was Messiah…He was without sin…which meant He never broke the 4th Commandment.

In His teaching He upheld the authority and validity of the Mosaic Law.24   His emphasis, however, was not on the external observance of the law, but on a spontaneous performance of the will of God which underlaid the law.25  

  I agree of course that Jesus upheld the authority and validity of the Mosaic Law.  It was in fact…His Fathers law…and, it was His Law as God in flesh.  And, according to His Law (Deuteronomy 13) if He taught against Torah…He was to be considered a false prophet and could not in fact have been Messiah.  Now…concerning Chuck’s comment when he says  His emphasis, however, was not on the external observance of the law, but on a spontaneous performance of the will of God which underlaid the law”.  I wish that my walk was always just a “spontaneous performance of the will of God” but truth be known it isn’t.   Sometimes I have to make a willing choice to obey God externally when my flesh would rather not.  While I agree that God is after our hearts…I believe that a good place for us to start is with an “external observance of the law”.  Without that first step…you will never make it to “spontaneous performance”.  Scriptures are filled with accounts of God’s people making the choice to obey even when they did not want to. In fact…I don’t think that the cross was a “spontaneous performance” by Jesus…I believe it was a choice He made out of love for His Father’s will…and out of love for us. His should be our example always.

 In regards to the Sabbath, He clarified the true meaning by showing the original purpose for its institution: The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath .  – Mark 2:27

True…and this does not nullify the Command to keep it. 

 Six Conflicts

Jesus asserted His lordship over the Sabbath.26   He defended His disciples for plucking grain on the Sabbath by alluding to the time when David and his men ate the bread of the Presence.27  In so doing, Jesus placed the Sabbath commandment in the same class as the ceremonial law.  Human need had precedence over the ceremonial requirements.  He also reminded His critics that the priests in the Temple profaned the Sabbath and were held guiltless.28   He referred to the circumcision of a male on the Sabbath Day.29       Jesus expressed anger over those at Capernaum who showed more concern for the punctilious observance of the Sabbath than for a human being who was deprived of the use of a hand.30   Likewise, he was angered by the ruler of the synagogue who became indignant when Jesus healed a woman who had a spirit of infirmity for 18 years.31

 There were seven healings on the Sabbath.32   (However, there were also healings on other non-Sabbath days.33 )  In all of these instances, Jesus showed that He placed human need above mere external ceremonial observance of the Sabbath.  He never did or said anything to suggest that He intended to take away from man the privileges afforded by such a day of rest.

Most of this was addressed earlier.  God wants us to obey Him and do good works every day.  I would point out that Chuck ends by saying Jesus never did anything to suggest He would take away the Sabbath.  I agree.  Remember however that while the Sabbath is an awesome gift and “privilege” as Chuck says here…it is also a Commandment from the King of the Universe. 

The Early Christians

The early Christians were loyal Jews; they worshiped daily in the Temple at Jerusalem;34  they attended services in the synagogue;35  they revered the law of Moses.36 

Notice that Paul did not try to persuade them to drop the Sabbath and start meeting on Sunday. 

 The dispute over the requirements of a Gentile Christian were resolved at the Council at Jerusalem.37

Here Chuck throws out a quick statement referring to Acts 15 in an attempt I assume, to say that only the Jews need obey Torah commands such as Sabbath.  Is this really what the disciples taught?  Many bible teachers make the mistake of stopping one verse short of fully understanding Acts 15. I believe this includes Chuck Missler…but you be the judge. The following is taken from a teaching I wrote called “Seven Filter’s” and should address Chuck’s comment above as it addresses Acts 15…  

  In the book of Acts.  (Acts 15:19-21) we see an interesting decision made by the disciples concerning non-Jews who have turned to the God of Israel. They send instructions for these new believers to “abstain from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, (which can only be defined in the Torah) from things strangled, and from blood”.  Is this all that is required  for “new testament” Believers?  Are these the only instructions we need to abide by as Christians today?  Of course not.  In fact we don’t even find a prohibition of murder listed in these instructions from James.  So what’s going on? The answer lies in the very next verse… “For Moses has had throughout many generations those who preach him in every city, being read in the synagogues every Sabbath.”  Did you catch it? The Disciples are rightly expecting these new Believers, although they have the Holy Spirit to guide them,  to study, learn and apply the Torah, God’s instructions to their lives. In time, they would learn how to live as children of the God of Israel. They would learn about clean and unclean, they would learn God’s definition of food and to abstain from eating the abominable.  They would learn about His Sabbath’s and appointed times.  They would learn to treat others, as they themselves would want to be treated. They would learn Torah, the instructions of a loving Father, given to His children.

 The Dangers of Legalism

Obedience to God is not legalism. It would appear that Chuck is playing the “bait and switch” game.  I have never heard anyone teach that “you must keep Sabbath to be saved”.  Again…we are talking about simple obedience to God’s Commands.   Is there danger in Legalism by my saying “A Christian should not commit adultery”?

Paul emphasized that the law was a yoke of bondage from which the Christian had been set free.38   Paul made no distinction between moral and ceremonial law.  It was all part of that old covenant which was done away in Christ.39   It was “nailed to the cross.”40     This is the central teaching of the New Testament. 

The preceding statements by Chuck are used in an attempt to bury those who would teach obedience to God’s Commands under a mountain of false theological assumptions. I am sure you have heard these statements before…they are echoed from pulpit to pulpit in these last days. Fortunately, it’s not that difficult for you and I to dig out from under if… we apply some proper context, and recall some warnings from Scripture. Let’s take them one at a time…

 “yoke of bondage”… Paul emphasized that we as Christians had been set free from the law of sin and death. (Romans 8:2)  No longer were we bound to sin…and no longer were we under the condemnation, the death sentence that it brought. We were free…saved by grace.  Paul asked a good question for Chuck to consider in Romans 3:31…”Do we then make void the law through faith?  Certainly not! On the contrary we establish the law.  In Romans 6:1 Paul said “ What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Certainly not! How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it?  Also, Paul says in Romans 7:12 that “Therefore the law is holy and commandment holy and just and good.”  Does it sound like Paul was teaching people they were free to disobey or ignore God’s Commandments?  Of course not, otherwise Paul would have been a false prophet.  Being instructed to honor one’s mother and father is not a “yoke of bondage”. Paul tells us in Acts 24 14 that he believes “all things which are written in the Law and in the Prophets”.  This would include the 4th Commandment.

 Moral and ceremonial law”I agree with Chuck here. Paul understood that any instruction given by the God of the universe is a “Moral Command”. Which means if the Sabbath was nailed to the cross…so were prohibitions against murder…bestiality…etc. 

   Done away with”…”Nailed to the cross…Chuck wants you to think that Jesus did away with the Torah (Law of Moses) when He went to the cross.  Thankfully…Jesus went out of His way to make sure you know different.  In fact He gave commandment saying “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets.  I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.  For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. Matthew 5:17-18   At this point I always encourage people to note that heaven and earth are still here…and that not all prophecy has been fulfilled.  Now, Jesus went on and issued a very interesting warning to all of us, to which bible teachers should take special note.   He said Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven. I am not sure exactly what “least in the kingdom” means…but the point should be clear.  Telling people that all of God’s law was “done away with” or “nailed to the cross” is not wise according to Scripture.  

 Central teaching of the New Testament”…Chuck says that the “central teaching” of the “New” testament is that God’s Commandments are no longer valid.  Is it any wonder that within some congregations today we have arguments over whether homosexuality is sin?    

There are no grounds for imposing the Sabbath on the Christian, who is free from the burden of the law’s demands.    The Spirit of Christ enables him to fulfill God’s will apart from the external observances of the law.free from the burden of the law’s demands”…

What a twist. Actually, Scripture teaches that we have been set free from sin (Romans 6:18,22)…not free to sin by breaking God’s law. God’s will is for us to obey Him out of a heart of love.  And to say that because I now have the Spirit of God in me…I am somehow “enabled” to obey God while not obeying Him is nonsense. Burden of the laws demands”…The law is not a burden according to Scripture.  David delighted in God’s Torah. I would encourage all to read Psalm 119 and then consider 1John 5:2 which says “For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments.  And His commandments are not burdensome.”

The Spirit of Christ”…Here is what the Scripture really says about “walking in the Spirit…”  “For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.  For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.  (WHY??? Listen closely to Paul’s answer…) Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God nor indeed can be.  So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God. (Romans 8:5-8) Friends, Paul makes it clear that to live according to the Spirit is to subject oneself to God’s law.  Thus we can be assured if we are being “enabled” to disobey any of God’s Commandments…it is not by the Spirit of God. 

The Sabbath is mentioned along with the festivals and new moons, all of which are declared to be “only a shadow of what is to come.”41   To “observe days, and months, and seasons, and years” is deemed to be slaves to “the weak and beggarly elemental spirits.”42   The ritual observance of days is a characteristic of “the man who is weak in faith.”43

Interestingly enough, Peter warned us about men who would not understand the words of Paul and told us to be on guard lest we be led away in serious error.  Concerning Paul and his writings Peter says that there are in them “some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.  You therefore, beloved since you know this beforehand, beware lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the error of the wicked; (2 Peter 3:16-17)

weak and beggarly elements”…If you really believe Paul would refer to God’s Appointed Times….His Sabbath’s as “weak and beggarly” then by all means have nothing to do with any of them. If however you struggle with that notion…take heart.  In Galatians 4 Paul is talking to former pagans (Gal 4:8) and shows great concern that they are returning to some of their former practices. (Gal 4:9) In verse 10 Paul says “You observe days and months and seasons and years.  I am afraid for you, lest I have labored for you in vain.” Nowhere does Paul refer to the Sabbath in this letter. And after all, how could former pagans “turn again” to keeping the Sabbath, something which they had never done before.

“The ritual observance of days is a characteristic of the man who is weak in faith”   *****(Interestingly Chuck himself has already pointed out that it was the custom of Jesus to observe the Sabbath…)***** We in fact know from Scripture that Jesus kept all of God’s Appointed Times.  The Gospel of Luke tells us very plainly that it was a “characteristic” of Jesus to observe the Sabbath. (Luke 4:16)  Let’s read it just for fun…”And as His custom was He went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day and stood up to read.” As a matter of fact, Scripture makes it clear that He kept all of God’s Appointed Times as outlined in Leviticus chapter 23.  What about Paul?  Was he “weak in faith”? Acts 17:2 says “Then Paul, as his custom was, went in to them, and for three Sabbaths reasoned with them from the Scriptures”.  What about Isaiah? What about Daniel? Being labeled as weak in faith from a “religious leader” really does not surprise me.  Revelation speaks about the persecution of those who “keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ” (Revelation 12:17) Interestingly, it was always the “religious leaders” who were persecuting Jesus and his followers.

The writer of Hebrews emphasizes that the Sabbath is also a type of “God’s rest” which is an inheritance of all the people of God.44     We are urged, in a larger sense, to “strive to enter that rest.”

I agree 100%.  Notice here…Chuck makes the point that Sabbath is for “all the people of God” and that we should “strive to enter that rest”.  Curiously…Chuck just got thru saying that those who observe such things are “slaves to the weak and beggarly elemental spirits” and “weak in faith”.  Am I missing something?

The Sunday “Sabbath”

 The first day of the week is now widely observed as the Sabbath.  But where has God expressly authorized this change? 

 Not to be found. 

After His resurrection, which took place on the first day of the week, Jesus appeared to His disciples on four occasions which were on a Sunday.45     This becomes a major part of the basis of the veneration of Sunday as the “Lord’s Day,” ostensibly replacing the traditional Sabbath.

There you have it.  Chuck has correctly given you the Scriptural justification that Christianity uses to nullify one of God’s Ten Commandments.  Talk about flawed hermeneutics. Notice that Chuck admits that “This becomes a major part of the basis of the veneration of Sunday as the “Lord’s Day,” ostensibly replacing the traditional Sabbath.” Are you willing to change one of God’s Commands based upon this line of reasoning? Jesus never said or did anything to suggest any change of the 4th Commandment. 

 Pentecost, the birth of the church, was also, by definition, on a Sunday.46  They did meet on a Sunday night,47  but that would actually be Monday in Jewish reckoning. 

No comment…

While these are suggestive, they are far from a conclusive teaching.48    (The oft-quoted 1 Corinthians 16:1, 2  is also unclear: “…that there be no gatherings when I come.”?) 

 They are not even suggestive.  In the wildest stretch of the imagination they never suggest altering or abolishing the 4th Commandment. 

The Hebrew Sabbath, has, of course, continued to be observed by non-Christian Jews to the present time.  During the first century some Jewish Christians also continued the practice of observing the seventh day of the week, as well as the assembly for worship on the first day of the week, but their influence on Christianity, discernible for several centuries, dwindled rapidly.  It has been suggested that with the rise of anti-Semitism in the early centuries, Sunday worship was a convenient means of excluding the Jewish believers.

Chuck hits on something very important here…anti-Semitism in the Roman church.  It has much to do with this issue…

Caveats About the “Early Church”

The writings of a number of the early church fathers in the 2nd and 3rd centuries support the tradition of Sunday worship.  However, the views of the early church after the book of Acts is, in some views, an unreliable basis to establish doctrine.

Count me in the ranks of those “some” who Chuck mentions. To establish any doctrine that contradicts the foundation of Scripture is wrong.  Paul says that all Scripture is useful for “doctrine”. Early teachings of the catholic church are not.

When Jesus sent His Seven Letters to Seven Churches (Revelation Chapters 2 and 3), each was surprised by their report card.  Those that thought they were doing well weren’t.  Those that thought they were not doing well, were.  Even by the late 90s the church was already substantially deviant from the Lord’s desires.

Now…add another 2000 years… 

Also, eschatological errors (i.e., Amillennialism, et al.) were rampant, as well as errors due to the Gnostic influences, etc.  Furthermore, the rising anti-Semitism in the early church, along with the allegorical hermeneutics promoted by Origen and later by Augustine, makes their views regarding the Sabbath rather suspect. 

 Some good points…

These anti-Semitical tendencies subsequently rose to include the emergence of “blood libel” and other abuses that were reflected in the Crusades and other medieval horrors.  Most of us as Gentiles have little appreciation for the abuses suffered by the Jews-under the banner of “Christ”-unless we have undertaken a careful study of the bloody history of the church.49

 I would suggest reading “The Popes Against the Jews” written by David I. Kertzer.  It can be purchased online from Amazon or such.  It is very well written and documented. 

The “Christian Sabbath” Views

There are, of course, many diverse views regarding Sunday as the “Christian” Sabbath, and there are those who strongly adhere to the traditional Saturday as the Sabbath.  Many of us may have encountered the legalistic zeal of the Seventh-Day Adventists over this “Seventh Day” issue; however, it is not the Seventh Day which emerges as the critical theological issue – it is the role of the law, and our liberty in Christ, that is really the fundamental issue.

Having failed to show from Scripture where the Sabbath was changed or done away with…Chuck will now make another attempt at doing away with all of God’s law in direct contradiction to the words of Jesus in Matthew 5.  I am not a Seventh Day Adventist by the way…

The Epistles to the Galatians, Colossians, and Romans far overshadow any particular cultural customs and ritual observances, and clearly emphasize our freedom from all external rules as the key to the entire New Testament Gospel.  That, indeed, is the “Good News.”

The 4th Commandment is not a cultural custom or ritual observance.  It is a instruction from the King of the Universe.  And again…we have never been given permission or “freedom” to decide what is right and what is wrong.  Chuck’s assertion that the “Good News” is freedom from “all external rules” and “key to entire New Testament Gospel” is quite troubling. The Gospel message that Jesus brought is clear from the beginning of Matthew and continues thru the book of Revelation…   From that time Jesus began to preach and to say, “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.”  (Matthew 4:17)   Blessed are those who do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city” (Revelation 22:14)   I know that Jesus paid the price for my sins on the cross…but that does not give me permission to break God’s Commandments. 

 Concerning the Epistles to the Galatians, Colossians, and Romans…the following is taken from my “Seven Filters” teaching concerning the proper context of Paul’s writings…    

We know that Paul loved the Lord, and we know that Paul devoted his life to serving his Master. He was a bondservant of  Messiah. We also know, and this is the important part…that Paul would never teach people to disobey the God of Israel, buthe did come against anyone who tried to add to what Jesus had done on the cross. This is what we see happening in the book of Galatians for example.  In Galatians 5:4 Paul says “You have become estranged from Messiah, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace”.  Remember, Paul was not against the law. His own words bear witness to this. So, what was he against?  He was against those who would teach the law as a means for salvation.  Do you see the difference? Most Bible teachers have missed the context of Paul’s writings, substituting obedience for justification.  Paul was not teaching us to ignore God’s commandments when he said “Stand fast therefore in the liberty by which Christ has made us free, and do not be entangled again with a yoke of bondagePaul was warning us not to listen to those who would seek to put conditions on God’s unconditional love.  Rest assured that Paul does not teach us to ignore the instructions of the Living God. In fact, if he did, then he was a false prophet as according to Deuteronomy 13 and deserving of death by stoning.  Speaking of stoning, do you know why Stephen was stoned to death?  If you remember he too was falsely accused of something.  You can find the answer in Acts 6:11-14.  Hold on to your hat and check it out!! And remember, this is after Jesus went to the cross!!

Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holy day, or of the new moon, or of the Sabbath days :  –  Colossians 2:16

 I do not mean to be offensive, but if Chuck Missler is using this verse in proper context then I would assume it would be okay for me to get drunk every day…feast on bloody batwings and of course ignore one of the Ten commandments… namely the 4th.  Of course…we know this is not what Paul was advocating.   Approaching Colossians 2 with proper hermeneutics will yield the student a much clearer view of Paul’s point.  I will let you do the homework this time.  Search Colossians chapter two for context…  Hint…keep your ears open for words and phrases such as “deception”…“persuasive words”…“philosophy”… “empty deceit”…“traditions of men” along with “basic principles of the world” and ask yourself whether Paul’s concern is with those who wanting to obey God’s Commandments.

 It is interesting that Paul emphasizes that it is the “weaker” ones in faith that burden themselves with such things (Cf. Romans 14:1-6).

Because Chuck brings this up again…I will speak very direct. It bothers me to hear someone in a position of leadership or authority attempt to intimidate others into quiet subjection to their point of view by denigration or “labeling.”  It especially troubles me when it is done by taking Scripture out of context.  Let us remember that Paul considered the Berean’s to be of a more “noble character” because they would not just take him at his word, but would “search the Scriptures” to see if what he said was true.  (Acts 17:11) Paul did not consider them “weak in the faith” for being burdened with a heart for truth.  Paul himself tells us to “Test all things; hold fast what is good” (1 Thess 5:21) 

Prophetic Implications

From the standpoint of Bible prophecy, however, there are some provocative enigmas which also emerge from the Seventh Day issue.  The Sabbath is an intrinsic part of the creation, specifically for man.50     It isn’t intrinsically limited to the Mosaic Covenant.  Sabbaths will continue as a basis for worship in the Millennium: For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.  And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one Sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.  Isaiah 66:22, 23

A very good point…one that conflicts of course with Chuck’s earlier assertion that the Sabbath instructions were only for a certain “dispensation.”

The Sabbath will also be honored in Ezekiel’s Temple: the gate to inner court will be closed six days and only opened on the Sabbath and on the day of the new moon.51

Very true…

Since the Sabbath apparently survives the church period,52 this seems to cloud the view that Sunday replaced the Sabbath. 

Conclusions

The veneration of the first day as a memorial of the Resurrection is certainly appropriate, although its historical role as a replacement day of worship is arguable.  Its formal institution appears to have been an expedient exploited by Emperor Constantine and following.53 The Sabbath is intended as a time of devotion, not a subjection to burdensome rules.  It is for the benefit of man, to be taken advantage of.  As a demonstration of God’s love, and a partaking of His blessing, the seventh day apparently has not been permanently set aside. 

Our God is Jewish.  “Salvation is of the Jews.”54   All of our benefits are derivative from the Abrahamic covenant.  We are grafted in the true olive tree, from the root of Abrahamic covenant (Romans 11).  We should not forget that we serve the King of the Jews.  We are members of a church founded by Jewish leaders; our highest authority is a Jewish Bible. 

While we have been freed from the law, we still can  enjoy the benefits of Creation.In our culture, we enjoy two free days each week, in any case.  The first-day worship is thus available to us as an opportunity.  The seventh-day Sabbath is also still available to us as an opportunity,  yet not under the law:One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.   –  Romans 14:5

While we may not know the exact issue Paul addresses in Romans 14:5…we can be sure it is not the issue of whether or not to honor the 7th day Sabbath Command.  Paul begins Romans 14 by saying not to dispute “doubtful things”.   Did Paul have any doubts about whether or not to obey the 4th Commandment?  Does Chuck really think Paul taught everyone to just “follow the dictates of their hearts”?

So the question is, Can we enjoy the benefits of the Sabbath without “coming under the law?” [We adopt other Jewish practices to our benefit without incurring the burdens of the law: circumcision (for hygienic reasons), some of the dietary practices, etc.]It is clear to me that Adam, Cain, Enoch, Noah, et al., all had instruction on the seventh day of rest.  It was the pattern in Exodus 16 before the manna was given and was memorialized in the Decalogue.  In addition, it was observed by Christ ceremonially.

The error we can easily fall into, however, is legalism and its deprivations of the fundamental blessings of our redemption.  (Study Paul’s definitive teaching in Romans.)

Romans 3:20 “therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight…

Romans 3:31Do we then make void the law through faith? Certainly not!  On the contrary, we establish the law. 

Romans 6:1 “What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Certainly not!  How shall we who died to sin live any longer in it?”

Romans 6:15  What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not!  Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness?

Scriptural definition of sin…”Whoever commits sin also commits lawlessness, and sin is lawlessness.” 1John 3:4

Our Personal Resolution

Nan and I, personally, have resolved-in the absence of travel or other logistic or scheduling constraints-to “remember the Sabbath Day” by adopting the following procedure:1. From Friday sundown to Saturday sundown, we “set aside” the time for study, meditation, and as a departure from our normal routines.2. We have resolved to do whatever we do deliberately and together.3. There are no other “rules.”We don’t make it a “burden”: we simply attempt to avail ourselves of His intended blessing.  We attempt – in an informal but deliberate way – to study and reflect on His Word and find ways to praise Him.(Our schedule usually has us traveling or speaking on weekends.  If we were ever to organize our own local fellowship, we would prefer to meet Friday evenings, and leave the weekend free for family time.)

I am encouraged that the Misslers seek to honor the Sabbath day, even if it’s only when convenient.  I have tried to clearly address the issues in his teaching that I believe to be contrary to the whole of Scripture.  Chuck’s assertion that obedience to God’s Commandments is somehow optional with no real consequences for disobedience is wrong. Teaching that the Spirit of God somehow enables one to obey God without actually obeying His Commandments is nonsense in my view. Teaching that Messiah came and did away with His own Torah is most definitely wrong according to Messiah Himself.  And his teaching that those concerned with obeying one of God’s Commandments somehow demonstrates a “weakness in faith” is most certainly wrong.  I am hoping that Chuck will now “play the Berean” and correct or clarify these points and others in his teaching as needed.

*  *  *This article was excerpted from our Briefing Package, The Seventh Day .  A subsequent article will review some of the historical events surrounding the institution of Sunday as the traditional day of worship.This article was originally published in the
May 2000 Personal Update NewsJournal.
This article was excerpted from our Briefing Package, The Seventh Day .  A subsequent article will review some of the historical events surrounding the institution of Sunday as the traditional day of worship.
This article was originally published in the
May 2000 Personal Update NewsJournal.

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**NOTES**


1.      Genesis 7:2. 2.      The plan of redemption was being taught in Genesis  3:21: not by their own efforts, but by the shedding of innocent blood they would be covered. 3.      Ezekiel 44:23, 24. 4.      It is significant that there are no “evenings” and “mornings” connected to the seventh  day.  The Hebrew terms erev and boker, connoting “evening” and “morning,” may have had deeper implications in the staging of entropy reductions; see Stretching the Heavens . 5.      Exodus 16:22-28. 6.      Exodus 20:8-11. 7.      The six “days” of creation are clarified in Exodus 20:11.  Any problem with “24-hour days” isn’t in Genesis 1; it is here. 8.      Exodus 20:2; Deuternomy 4:13; 5:2-21. 9.      Who was his Creator?  John 1:1-3; Colossians 1:16, 17. 10.  Exodus 35:2,3 Leviticus 23:3 26:34. 11.  Isaiah 56:2,4,6,7 58:13,14; Jeremiah 17:20-22. (Cf. Nehemiah 13:19.)  12.  Exodus 25:3. 13.  Exodus 31:14-17. 14.  Leviticus 24:8; Numbers 28:9, 10. 15.  1 Chronicles 9:32; 23:31; 2 Chronicles 2:4; 8:13; 23:4; 31:3. 16.  Leviticus 12:3; John 7:22. 17.  Isaiah 1:12, 13. 18.  Isaiah 58:13,14. 19.  Jeremiah 17:21, 22; Ezekiel 22:8; Amos 8:4. 20.  Jeremiah 17:27; Exodus 20:23, 24. 21.  2 Chronicles 36:20, 21. 22.  A. Edersheim, The Life and Times of Jesus the Messiah, Volume II, p.777. 23.  Luke 4:16; Mark 1:21; 3:1; Luke 13:10. 24.  Matthew 5:17-20; 15:1-6; 19:16-19; 22:35-40; Luke 16:17. 25.  Matt hew 5:21-48;19:3-9. 26.  Matthew 12:8; Mark 2:28; Luke 6:5. 27.  Matthew 12:1-4; Mark 2:23-26; Luke 6:1-4. 28.  Matthew 12:5. 29.  Leviticus 12:3; John 7:22, 23. 30.  Mark 3:1-5; Matthew 12:8-14. 31.  Luke 13:10-17. 32.  Mark 1:21-27; Mark 1:29-31; John 5:1-9; Mark 3:1-6 (and  Matthew 12:8-14); Luke 13:10-17; Luke 14:1-6; John 9:1-14. 33.  Mark 1:32. 34.  Acts 2:46; 5:42. 35.  Acts 9:20; 13:14; 14:1; 17:1, 2, 10; 18:4. 36.  Acts 21:20. 37.  Acts 15. 38.  Galatians 3:2, 3; 5:1; et al. 39.  2 Corinthians 3:14. 40.  Colossians  2:14. 41.  Colossians 2:16, 17. 42.  Galatians 4:9, 10; Cf. Colossians 2:20. 43.  Romans 14:1-6. 44.  Hebrews 4:1-11. 45.  Matthew 28:1; Mark 16:2; Luke 24:1; John 20:1. 46.  Acts 2:1. 47.  Acts 20:7. 48.  The assertion that “we never see Christ meeting with his disciples on any other day” appears to be contradicted by John 20:26, “… after eight days again…” 49.  See our briefing package, The Kingdom of Blood for a shocking survey and its prophetic implications. 50.  Genesis 2:2, 3. 51.  Ezekiel 46:1ff. 52.  Matthew 24:20; Isaiah 66:22, 23; Ezekiel 46:1ff. 53.  We will review this in a follow-up article in next month’s Personal UPDATE. 54.  John 4:22.

45 comments

  1. After reviewing the issue I personally believe that the sabbath commandament is ceremonial and due to end under the new covenat since it is the only commandament out of the ten that you can brake openly ( do exactly all the opposite that it commands not to do )during 6 days of the week except for one day…now I ask you, which one of the other nine commandaments can be treated like this one and yet call yourself a true christian ?? we woudn’t dare to kill or steal or commit adultery in ANY day of the week…why ?? because these 9 commandament ARE NOT SUBJECT TO TIME OR DAYS OR WEEKS…why ?? because THEY ARE MORAL COMMANDAMENTS, you see, moral commandaments have this one distinction from ceremonial commandaments, they are not to be broken at ANY TIME UNDER ANY CONDITIONS BY ANY PEOPLE ,they are eternal and always binding. there are things in the word of God that though spoken and commanded by God himself have a temporal nature,for instance, the samaritan woman asked Jesus which one was the truth temple to worship God, he replied, the one at Jerusalem, was it so ?? YES God himself commanded to all the people to assembled in Jerusalen at least once a year so his answer was correct BUT he did not stop there, he added, BUT VERILY I TELL YOU THAT THE TIME HAS COME AND NOW IT IS WHEN IT WILL NOT BE IN JERUSALEM OR HERE AND THERE BUT IT WILL BE ANY WHERE AS LONG AS YOU WORSHIP HIM IN SPIRIT AND TRUTH FROM YOUR HEART BECAUSE GOD SEEKS FOR SUCH WORSHIPPERS.
    what do we have here ?? a ceremonial commandament which was due to change at one point in history, same thing with the fourth commandament, let’s imagine same conversation, lord, which one is the day we should observed as holly ?? Sabbath, Sunday or Friday ?? Jesus response would be, ” It is written, the sabbath ” BUT he would also add VERILY I TELL YOU THAT THE TIME HAS COME AND NOW IT IS WHEN IT WILL NOT BE THE SABBATH OR SUNDAY OR FRIDAY BUT IN ANY DAY OF THE WEEK AS LONG AS YOU LIVE EVERYDAY A HOLLY LIFE WALKING IN THE SPIRIT AND IN TRUTH, again, same principle, a commandment given by God but due to be replaced by something far better than just a holly day….A HOLLY LIFE THE SEVEN DAYS OF THE WEEK !! so IT IS NOT the letter of the law which is eternal but THE SPIRIT of the law (the principle behind the letter, in this case,HOLLINESS) which stands forever.

    God Bless.


  2. I can’t believe that there is only on comment posted to this dialogue…


  3. This is a well thought-out response.

    While I love Chuck Missler, I disagree with him on many of the same points -regarding the Sabbath – that you do. The interesting thing is, that he is an advocate of the Sabbath – although quite lightly.

    I also disagree with him regarding weather we should keep Easter and Christmas. We should worship Him in Spirit and Truth.

    I would also like to know more about you. What are your views on the Trinity? Are an advocate of Armstrongism? Are you a Messianic Jew? Where do you worship?

    Respectfully,

    Kevin 🙂


  4. So if the SUN-DAY is not a sabbath..or day of the rest,..that means that Saturday IS!

    Not complicated at all!

    Thank you.


  5. I wonder if Dr. Missler will be given a chance to defend his statements. You’ve said, and I agree that keeping the sabbath, or the holy days for that matter won’t save you, Only the blood of our Messiah can do this. So then, keeping the law won’t save us either, it only shows us that we can’t keep it perfectly, and so puts us under condemnation because of this. If you want to keep the sabbath, then go ahead, if you believe that you are doing this in obediance of God, then do so. I believe that Jesus is my sabbath rest which is not just one day, but everyday. He did what you or I cannot do; He kept the whole law perfectly, and without sin, and therefore made the law obsolete. If you want to keep the sabbath and holy days, as you’ve said they can’t save you, then what’s the point? If the jews broke the law, they were under condemnation, and depending on which part of the law, they were killed i.e the man gathering sticks on the sabbath. And only the blood of an innocent sacrifice could cover their sins. Jesus is our innocent lamb slain before the foundation of the world whose blood saved us. One more question; I notice that most of the proponents of the law, do not mention the book of Galatians, and what Paul had to say on the subject of the law.


    • Thanks Matt for stopping by and showing interest in this subject. First of all, I am not sure what you mean about Chuck Missler being given a chance to defend himself. I assure you he is welcome to respond to this very open refutation as you have done. Also, when I first posted this I sent him a copy personally with a note encouraging an open dialogue if he wished. As of this date I have never gotten a response. In this refutation I included his entire teaching along with footnotes…he voluntarily stated his position openly and I have responded with clear and concise Scriptural support for a different viewpoint.

      Secondly, thanks for reading enough of my response to understand I am not a legalist. Only the blood of our Messiah as you said can save us. With that most important fact understood by both you and me we can continue on to discuss the issue of Sabbath etc. Jesus said if you love Me, keep My commandments. That is what I teach.

      You said that if I believe I am keeping Sabbath and such out of a desire to be obedient then it was okay for me to do so. That is exactly why I do it. The question is did God change His mind on the 4th Commandment Matt? I say no. I assume you believe that He did? Where? Saying you believe that Jesus is your Sabbath rest is one thing…laying out the Scriptural foundation for me to latch on to your belief might be quite another. Jesus kept the sabbath. He is whom I seek to imitate as Paul told us to do.

      You said that Jesus made the law obsolete by keeping it perfectly….again…show me from Scripture as I am not prone to accepting something as truth just because a man believes it. I challenge you here and now to quote the Scripture verse where God made His commandments obsolete. Jesus commanded us not to think that way in Matthew 5…and He told us not teach such things as well. While Jesus took the condemnation away, He never gave us permission to sin. As I am sure you are aware…the very definition of sin is transgression of God’s commandments. That would include the 4th I am sure.

      I must say that when reading your comments I become concerned as to whether or not you actually read my entire refutation and checked out what I said against Scripture for yourself. It seems to me sadly, that you are just repeating those things espoused by many teachers such as Chuck Missler without playing the Berean.

      Finally concerning Paul and the Epistle to the Galatians… I am at a loss to understand your comment. I quote Paul and his view of the Law all the time and even did so in this teaching. He taught and lived the Torah with everything he had. He tells us that more than once…. (“I worship the God of my fathers, believing all things which are written in the Law and the Prophets” Acts 24:14) Also, if you would notice, I not only mention the book of Galatians, I have a link on my site where you go to hear an entire verse by verse audio teaching of Galatians taught by myself. If nothing else, I would encourage you to at least listen to my intro to Galatians as I talk a lot about Paul.

      Feel free to respond again if after having examined my refutation further, you have comments or questions. Thanks, Tim


      • Tim thanks a billion for your article it was truthful AND scriptural. I just spent 3 or 4 hours looking at several of Misslers video presentations and at the end of one I was deeply bothered by his seeming dodge of one womans questions about the catholic church. so I googled “misslers views on the catholic church” and I scrolled up your site out of maybe 10 or so and was shocked to see his views quickly and honestly presented. I already examined the catholic beliefs and saw they were really wrong [the blasphemous things they attribute to the popes ect.] and found that a pope commanded that the Sabbath be not observed on pain of death and or excommunication ect. way back; so I was shocked at Misslers weak non reply to the woman; and wanted to know more about him. Thanks for the massive update. I sure hope Missler is not some 35% false prophet leading the weak astray with a lot of talk about robotics and what not, while minimizing or even dismissing highly important things that Jesus wants us to do Keith


  6. Interesting reading. Could you tell how one observes the sabbath in todays society in regards to church fellowship.

    I’m no bible scholar so forgive me if I seem simple to you, but where there not laws about what was clean and not clean and who where jews and gentiles? Can this not be applied in this argument? Decided other way and live in Gods grace. Luke 23:43 ….What law qualified this man?

    I’m not for or against your argument, in fact you sound quite knowledgeable on the bible and as most people can do, that is, take scripture to back up their point of view. (again not saying you are wrong, you make good points).

    I read a good article on the fact that there were more than just the two thieves on the cross with Jesus, their were criminals too. Yet the picture that is always painted is of Jesus and two others. The long and short of it is, read and test and see what is true for yourself.

    Blessings.


  7. Hi Tim, could you send me some more info on what your beliefs are. Is following the Torah all of the old testiment law or just the ten commandments?

    Since reading some of your writings I have been doing my own studied which has been fruitful.
    Gods blessing
    Scott


    • Thanks for the question Scott. By the way, it’s a good question.

      First of all, I am thankful that God has used me in some small way to encourage someone to dig into the Scriptures. You are like a Berean who would search the Scriptures to find out if what Paul taught was true. (By the way I am no Paul) Anyway, I appreciate your taking the time to consider what I write.

      Now to your question. This will be short as I don’t have a lot of time at present but I pray it might be helpful to you. I want you to know firstly that I don’t understand everything perfectly and that I continue to learn. I am sure that I don’t do everything perfectly.

      When I speak of Torah, I refer to all of God’s instructions as given from a loving God to His children. This would include not only the Ten Commandments but all of the Law as spoken thru the prophet Moses. As example, I believe that His definition of food for us as found in Leviticus 11 is as important for us today as it was when given to Moses. Remember what Jesus (Yeshua) said in Matthew 5. (Not one jot or tittle) Now, there are some Commandments that do not apply to you today Scott. You are most likely not a Levite Priest for example. Many of the commandments applied to the Priesthood. Some applied only to women. Also, we do not have a Temple, and many instructions were Temple dependent. For example, sacrifices. According to Deuteronomy 12 sacrifices were only to be done at the Temple.

      With this in mind, I believe that we should be about observing any and all commandments that we are able to obey. Helping the widow and orphan… honoring the Sabbath and Appointed Times…refraining from eating what God calls detestable…anything that we can do to line up our definitions, our lives with what God has declared in His Word with Messiah always our example.

      Concerning the Ten Commandments. Scripture never teaches that we should obey only the Ten, while ignoring others. Jesus warned about breaking and teaching others to break even the very least of the commandments. (Matthew 5:17-19) By the way, many Christians promote the Ten Commandments except for the 4th. Does that really make sense? Quoting from the Torah, Jesus said that men should live by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God. (Matthew 4:4, Deut 8:3) Paul said that all Scripture was for instruction in righteousness. (2 Timothy 3:16) He said that before there was a “new” testament.

      I hope this give you a few things to consider. Please write again if you have other questions. I apologize for being so brief and would love to continue this if needed. May God bless you Scott, and keep digging and applying as you learn. Tim


  8. Here is how I understand it ……..through scripture ….

    In the New Testament epistles there are only 2 references pertaining to the Sabbath (Col.2:16; Heb.4:4)
    Both of these passages the apostle Paul quite clearly explains that the day is not a required day to be observed by Christians.
    To the Hebrews in the Old Covenant they were under obligation in the New Covenant neither Jews nor gentiles are.
    There is no command after the death and resurrection for the Church to keep the Sabbath as an obligation to Christ……

    If a person is to keep the Sabbath day as note : law – then they are under the obligation to also observe the Sabbath year referance Lev.25:17.
    The land is to be tilled for six years and the seventh year is the Sabbath year. Now in the verses 8-24 Israel is instructed to number seven times seven Sabbath years (49)
    and the following year is the Jubilee 50th year which would be observed by no sowing or reaping….

    ok hope we are clear so far ………………..

    All slaves were to be released, and the land they purchased is to be returned to the original owner.
    All the debts were to be forgiven.
    For those who want to make the Sabbath day mandatory let them abide by the law and return the land they bought and forget all their debtors….

    Question :Does anyone do this ???????
    Answer : obviously not…

    So now you need to ask the question and ……..Why not. ?

    Hosea 2:11: “I will also cause all her mirth to cease, her feast days, her New Moons, her Sabbaths– all her appointed feasts.”

    Here we have God himself saying these will come to an end.
    He is the cause of it. . . clear from the text..
    This is not an permanent end………… and can be applied to Israel in her captivity……… or………… it can certainly fit in with the New Testament dispensation.

    Question :Didn’t Jesus keep the Sabbath ??????????
    Answer : Yes He did…

    Question you must now ask is simple:

    Question : but for what reason?

    This is important to try and grasp this ……

    He was born under the law and kept all the law …… scripture very clearly declares this…..
    If He violated even the smallest point he would have been disqualified to be the messiah…. I hope you can uderstand this ….
    Answer to the above : He would have become a transgressor and a sinner like us…….. clear again from scripture….

    Now read :

    Gal.4:4 says, “God sent forth his son, made of a woman, born under the law, to redeem them that were under the law.”

    Jesus was the only one who kept it perfectly….. and as believers we know this ..
    There are many who make an issue of Jesus being our example so we should imitate him in everything……… sure you have heard that statement ….

    Well…….. Jesus was circumcised on the 8th day
    He meaning Jesus …… observed all the feast days
    He also kept the entire law of Moses………… (613 commands)… Not just the 10 people are very quick to quote…..
    He never married…. correct yes…….. no matter what secular man declares scripture is the final word…
    Never had a permanent home while he walked this earth in his ministery.
    He also was very bold standing up to those who challenged the Word and His teaching.
    In His miracles He walked on water, healed people of diseases instantly and resurrected many.
    So can we all really……. use only the Sabbath as a means of following him and discard the rest ?

    Please understand …..the point is that he kept all the law even the smallest parts including what is called the law of Moses that was applicable to him (ceremonial, civil, dietary, etc. Certain portions of the law Jesus was not under, such as sacrifices for sin).

    Question : Do law keepers keep the 613 commands?

    The Jews did…. at least to the best off there ability as sinnful man…..

    Didn’t Paul keep the Sabbath?

    He went into the Jewish synagogues to preach to the Jews on their Sabbath day.Noted in Acts.13:14-43, 17:2, 18:4.

    He kept it as a custom to the Jews but it was not an obligation………

    We seriously need to make a clear distinction of the reason why it was kept and not just that it was mearly being observed.

    In Acts 13:42-43, They did not go to worship by obligation under the law but simply for the reason that this was the best means of reaching their brethren… seen in clear eading off the text.

    Paul and Barnabas had the freedom to assemble any day they had wished…. again clear from scripture …

    As they congregated together in the temple they invited Paul and Barnabas to come back the following Sabbath to speak to them more about the Gospel, many of the Jews and Gentile converts to Judaism followed them Paul and Barnabas admonished them to hold fast to the grace of God.

    Question : So now where is Grace found you ask ?
    Answer : simply ……. In Christ.

    Read verses 44-52 Paul and Barnabas returned the following Sabbath to preach the Gospel to nearly all the inhabitants of Antioch, who were anticipating to hear their message. …

    But they were met with stiff opposition from other Jews and Gentile converts to Judaism from the city.
    They became very jealous of their success of the message given with the people,
    So they felt the need to put out Paul and Barnabas from the area they where preaching the gospel in.
    It wasn’t the law……….. Acts 13 …….that was being preached, but the Gospel of Jesus Christ, grace, of which they began training them in.
    This is not any proof that they kept the Sabbath under the New covenant.
    Paul …….gives us the reason why he kept the law in 1 Cor.9:19-20: “For though I am free from all men, yet I have made myself servant unto all, that I might gain the more. And to the Jews I became a Jew, that I might win Jews; to those who are under the law (the Jews), as under the law, that I might win those under the law .

    id you catch that there his reason for it ?

    To those who are without a law (not being without a law toward God but under the law toward Christ) I might win those who are without law; to the weak I became as weak, that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.”

    Simple answer……….he made it clear he was not under the law but purposely put himself under it to reach those who were. Paul placed himself in many different situations, as one under the law ( _ including the sabbath – so he could reach the Jews with the Gospel.

    He became all things to all men so that he could present the gospel of grace, the only means of salvation.

    Paul’s model of evangelism was to the Jew first until they rejected his message; he then turned to the Gentiles…….. just as scripture clearly says….

    There is no record of Christians congregating outside the temple of Jews on the Sabbath, only in the temple.
    This mix was those who believed and those who did not.
    Certainly believers do not worship along with those who do not.
    What makes this very very interesting is that there are no more references to keeping the Sabbath after Acts 18:4-7……… Study the scripture yourself and see …

    This now has to make one wonder with the church becoming more Gentile than Jewish……… this fact would certainly be addressed in Acts 15… or the epistles if wrong……Yes ?, but it is clearly not.

    Most certainly it would have been presented as an opportunity for correction as the gentiles were entering the Church. ……
    Since they would not be familiar with worshipping on the Sabbath day as the custom of Judaism…. again this should be clear from scripture too you.

    In Acts 15…. this letter is written to address the essential things required for the fellowship of Jewish and Gentile Christians together.

    The keeping of the weekly Sabbath, or the observance of any feast day, are not mentioned…… consult the scripture here read it for yourself …

    There clearly is no command of eating clean and unclean foods.
    But …only a command to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, food containing blood, and food resulting from animal strangulation………. again clearly written in scripture.

    This letter to the Gentile Christians was written by the guidance of the Holy Spirit through Jewish Christian elders who counseled together in the Jerusalem Church…..

    Their conclusion was :

    “Now therefore why do you put God to the test by placing upon the neck of the disciples a yoke which neither our fathers nor we have been able to bear? Acts 15:9: “It was for freedom that Christ set us free; therefore keep standing firm and do not be subject again to a yoke of slavery.” Vs.21 “For Moses from ancient generations has in every city those who preach him, since he is read in the synagogues every Sabbath (Acts 15:24-25) Since we have heard that some who went out from us have troubled you with words, unsettling your souls, saying, ‘You must be circumcised and keep the law …………… to whom……………. we gave no such commandment!…………….”No such commandment…….. why?………….. Because they were under a new covenant.

    If you are an ernest contender for the faith ..You should catch on pretty quickly…..

    The epistles were mostly corrective letters reinforcing what was taught in person by the apostles and to add further revelation to what had already been taught.
    There was absolutely no warning against Sunday worship that would be construed as pagan worship.
    In fact we find it is the very opposite………… they were given freedom where they did not have before.

    Read for yourself …..

    Col.2:16 …….. mentions not to judge on days.
    Romans 14:6…….. says that we can pick whatever day we want to observe to the Lord.

    From the primordial Church there was a transition this is recorded in Acts 20 v 7.
    The writings show the early Jewish Christians kept both without any conflict, not like there is today. ……
    There was no challenge on this, unlike circumcision and the law that became a huge issue….. scripture shows us this…..

    They along with the apostle Paul believed quotin :Rom. 10:4: “For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes.”
    Simply by trusting in Christ’s work the law is fulfilled perfectly. Christ is the end Greek- telos meaning he is the goal of its intent.He refering to Jesus completed it and we enter into what he did by faith.

    Some questions to ask yourself : who or what did the apostles preach…… a day or the death and resurrection of the Saviour?

    What saves someone?

    This is the message of the NT.

    There are three options,

    1.you can keep the Sabbath day and never be saved by Christ.

    2.You can be saved by Christ and never keep the Sabbath day

    or

    3. you can be saved and keep the Sabbath day by personal choice…………………………….. but you cannot say for one to be saved they MUST keep the Sabbath.

    So ….. I believe alot off the messages here seam to be formed around a Jewish believer and is finding it hard to leave behind all the traditions and teachings . He is saved yes to the point of He has accepted Christ but is finding it hard to get away from the law and so putting himself right back under there……

    Also He never in these posts comes forward to declare who or what He has as a back ground for his thinking I can only read it for what He has posted..

    I also find in general terms and in know way am I pointing a finger … Many hear a sermon and like the preacher …. so just accept or come to a conclusion because a person says it…

    Nothing is because you like the preacher the sermon .. but simply what does God have to say about a matter…

    If you remeber nothing more Acts chp 17 v 11 …. use it as a rule off thumb ….

    A personal note is .. Many hear a sermon where ever and as they leave there place off worship wish the preacher or who ever best wishes on the sermon all sorts off glorifying comments .. to the preacher..

    How many do you see questioning him at all or if ever about the message just delivered to the people ……… usually none .. more interest is in getting home for dinner .
    The guy has the same sin as you … lust , etc. But on a whole its never even a thought that crosses ones mind .
    He went to college He studied he is qualified …

    Most dont want opposition to what they have taught as it can lead to them going against the very teaching school off thought they attended to preach. Why more interested in the fact is if a preacher does he chances to loss out on his pension after retiring rather that worring about those who he may have taught false doctrine too for years..

    I must add Thank our Father in heaven not all are like this………

    Be as a child .. I have children and they go … Daddy Daddy whats that mean ? why is that ? could you please explain it ? . and so forth …..

    We need to ask our Father …… the same .. and spend less time in asking man what he says a matter means … In meetings ask youself how many times do you hear this …

    Well i was reading that and i thought this … but after talking to Sam he explained it all and i now see this .. ok .. but I also read it and got this but the minister sad its really this …

    Ask God and when you want what he wants … He will show you …

    The skeptic asks let God show me this first and I will believe ……… God says believe first and I will show you all things ………….

    There are many great scolars out there and many agree to disagree on a subject .. but be careful when its a doctrine …. that is where it trully matters……..

    Pick a book just as example ……….

    Matthew , then ask and find out the following first …… who wrote it ? who was it wrote too ? why was it wrote ? and what was the times in history like at that moment and you will clearly find the hang ups most have simply disappear ……. cause they understand the context off the scripture at hand ….. God clearly opening there eyes to the truth…

    important also I didnt see mention off anyone asking for dicernment from God on a matter …….. the believer needs discernment .. to be able to see the truth … and show himself approved unto God and not man thats all that matters…

    God Bless you all and I pray He may be let by you too come closer …. To know the one who has saved you from the rath too come.

    Amen


  9. Im sorry I dont have time to respond to all your comments and scriptures you use so I will just point out a couple. You use Col to say to not let anyone condemn you in your observance of a holy day, yet you see no problem in doing that very thing to Dr. Missler. Then you use the scripture regarding the temple service in Eze. Do you not realize that temple wont be built until the mill. reign ? Do you not remember the 4 things the apostles said the gentile should keep ? Did Christ not defend His deciples when the pharisees accused them of breaking the Sabbath ? If you want to keep that part of the law shouldn’t you keep it all ? Do you know what the purpose of the law was ? Have you never broken the Sabbath and if you have, did you offer the proper sin offering or were you stoned to death and what temple did you do it in ? Have you never heard Dr. Missler say that you should do your own study and decide for yourself ? Im sorry, but I have learned more from Dr. Missler in the last few yrs than I did at any of the denominational churches and televangelists where I basically wasted 20 yrs of my life. Do you think God needs you or I to use this medium for this type of thing or is the Creator of the universe able to take care of Dr. Missler on His own ? I dont mean to sound harsh but I truly think this sort of thing has to stop. I pray God will lead us into all truth and help us to stop trying to destroy or degrade someone that doesnt believe or worship the same way we do.


  10. I am sorry that you don’t have time to address my points made from Scripture. I will look forward to it at a later time.

    I tried very hard to focus on what Chuck Missler said…I never attacked his character or questioned his motive. I too have learned much from Chuck as I most likely could from you. But he chose to put his teaching on the internet for all to read. I have done nothing more than offer my view based upon Scripture on this teaching. If you noticed, at times I agreed with him and said so. Thus I am a bit perplexed as to what you think I did that must stop. By the way, if you actually read the whole thing, you noticed that Chuck seeks to infer that individuals who concern themselves with obeying God’s Commandments as weak in faith. Isn’t that a bit degrading? Did not Jesus warn about breaking and teaching others to break even the least of the Commandments?

    A couple of other points on your comment…

    Do you really think Jesus was defending His disciples from actually breaking the Sabbath? As you said, they were accused of it…Jesus understood the difference between traditions of men and Commandments of God. I do not think they were breaking the command.

    Secondly, concerning Acts…Do you think that the list of four was an all inclusive list…what about murder, stealing…honoring your parents. If you read the Scriptures you refer to you will see that it was a starting point and that they were expected…yes expected to learn the Law of Moses over time. Read it for yourself in Acts 15:20-21.

    Thanks for stopping by, Shalom


  11. Dear Tim,

    This is an excellent commentary on one of Chuck Missler’s teachings. I love the man; however, some of his misunderstanding is based on a lot of brainwashing he received from other brainwashed men. The origins of their misleading people is tied into Peter’s prophesy regarding Paul’s “sometimes hard to understand writings that untrained and evil men would twist to their own damnation.” So many theologies/doctrines have resulted from that very thing. Unfortunately, I don’t believe it was all by accident. Unlike Peter, I don’t believe that Paul’s writings were accidently convoluted. Paul served as Jesus’ “chosen instrument” to fulfill Deuteronomy 13 in providing the “TEST” for God to see who would love Him enough to do as He said, or to follow someone else’s teachings.

    I’m certain you will disagree; however, since Pauline Christianity considers Paul as the greatest of the apostles, can you explain to me which one of the Lamb’s 12 apostles, including Mathias who replaced Judas Iscariot, didn’t do his job to make room for Paul’s name to appear on one of those 12 foundations?

    I’ve been looking for an answer to that question for years and haven’t found a single person to provide an answer yet.

    I’ll really would appreciate an anwer from you.

    Sincerely,
    Shirley


  12. Tim,

    Thanks for your comments regarding the Sabbath. My wife and I recently came to a better knowledge of the Sabbath while teaching on Creation… and began observing it as a result of understanding Exodus 13:9 from what God really says, not from what we were taught.

    We keep the law BECAUSE we are saved, not to BE saved.

    We wrote lesson plans on the subject and it was quite tickling to read what you wrote… like reading my own notes.

    The mark of the beast in Revelation 13 is the counterfeit of the sign in the hand and between the eyes in Exodus 13.

    Tim C


    • Praise the Lord…I love to hear you say “we keep the law because we are saved, not to be saved”… I think you got it. I pray that God continues to help both you and me in understanding His Torah…living it out…and teaching others both in word and deed.

      God bless, from another Tim C. !!


  13. Tim,

    Another comment from Tim C.

    This morning I was praying about the Sabbath teachings because my wife and I encounter all the arguments we always believed in the past about how the Sabbath has been replaced by grace and faith and Sunday and etc.

    I read through all the comments posted here and the one posted previous to my first (from Shirley) made me curious, so I looked up Deuteronomy 13.

    Deut.13
    [3] … for the LORD your God proveth you, to know whether ye love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul.

    This is the wording regarding the first and greatest commandment (Matthew 22:37, Mark 12:30) and is spelled out in the next verse.

    [4] Ye shall walk after the LORD your God, and fear him, and keep his commandments, and obey his voice, and ye shall serve him, and cleave unto him.

    NOTICE that the keeping of the commandments specifically references the 4th in the next verse when it mentions, “which brought you out of the land of Egypt.” See comments following Verse 5.

    [5] And that prophet, or that dreamer of dreams, shall be put to death; because he hath spoken to turn you away from the LORD your God, which brought you out of the land of Egypt, and redeemed you out of the house of bondage, to thrust thee out of the way which the LORD thy God commanded thee to walk in. So shalt thou put the evil away from the midst of thee.

    In Exodus 13:9 is the same wording. “And it shall be for a sign unto thee upon thine hand, and for a memorial between thine eyes, that the LORD’s law may be in thy mouth: for with a strong hand hath the LORD brought thee out of Egypt.”

    What law? Look at the wording of the 4th Commandment in Deuteronomy 5:15, which identifies the law associated with the sign in the hand and between the eyes (forehead) of Exodus 13:9. “And remember that thou wast a servant in the land of Egypt, and that the LORD thy God brought thee out thence through a mighty hand and by a stretched out arm: therefore the LORD thy God commanded thee to keep the sabbath day.”

    Daniel 7:25 says that the anti-Christ will think to “change times and laws.” What laws? Further study will show that Satan has always wanted the throne of God and that he wants the worship due to the Christ.

    Look where the mark of the beast is placed… “in their right hand, or in their foreheads.”

    What law is being changed? The law of the Sabbath.

    Revelation 13 reads:

    [16] And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
    [17] And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

    Lest there be any doubt that we have arrived at that day and time, please refer to http://www.family2012.com/en/catecheses.php, where the day of rest (the Sabbath) is clearly identified as the 7th day but is being proposed by LAW (Daniel 7:25) as Sunday. This is Revelation 13:16 being fulfilled.

    If there be any further doubt, the following was on the news, October 21, 2011, where buying/selling (economics) are proposed to be controlled by LAW by the same authority instituting the Sunday law. See http://www.zenit.org/article-33718?l=english. This is Revelation 13:17 being fulfilled.

    The “mark in the hand and forehead” and the control of “buying and selling” were both proposed to the world by the same beast (governing organization) in the same order as mentioned in the book of Revelation.

    “And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.” Revelation 19:20

    “Them” is anyone taking the mark.

    We are under a strong delusion. (2 Thessalonians 2:11). We have been taught for so long and have become so accustomed to the mark of the beast that we think it blasphemous to even question it… let alone reject it and/or the authority from which it comes.

    But the Bible says, “Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?” Romans 6:16

    And it also says in the book of James, “Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him; Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.” James 5:19-20

    In the days of Noah, a warning went out for 120 years (Genesis 6:3) and only eight listened and got on the ark. Hopefully we all have ears to hear… as Jesus implored.

    I am sure there will be questions, as I had many when I studied this through, questions I still encounter as this message goes out, but ones to which there are answers in scripture if one chooses to follow Jesus / The Word in lieu of the teachings and traditions of man.

    May God be blessed by all of you,

    Tim C


    • I have yet to write about this but would like to soon….Listening to you I feel like you would like to study this….Read and study the story of Jeroboam…answer the following. What does he do (concerning the subject at hand) and most importantly…WHY does he do it? Let me know what you find if you would…I would love to hear your reaction…Sincerely, Tim Terry


  14. Tim,

    Jeroboam does several things by his own will/choice. He:
    1) substituted golden calves (as Aaron did when leaving Egypt) as objects of worship (v. 28)
    2) changed the place of worship from Jerusalem to Bethel and Dan (vv. 27-30)
    3) appointed profane priests, not from the tribe of Levi (v. 31)
    4) changed the time of the feast of tabernacles from the 7th month, 15th day to the 8th month, 15th day (v. 32).

    Why? Fear of man (Prov 29:25) Fear of loss of power / control (1 Kings 12:26-27) “And Jeroboam said in his heart, Now shall the kingdom return to the house of David: If this people go up to do sacrifice in the house of the LORD at Jerusalem, then shall the heart of this people turn again unto their lord, even unto Rehoboam king of Judah, and they shall kill me, and go again to Rehoboam king of Judah.”

    Jeroboam changed WHO was being worshipped by corrupting HOW people worshipped, just as the anti-Christ changes who is actually being worshipped by changing how we are to honor Jesus by keeping His Word.

    According to 2 Thessalonians 2:4, the anti-Christ sits in “the temple” (believers are the temple of God) dictating how they are to honor Jesus contrary to God’s Word, thereby leading many to sin.

    I am reminded that the Jews kept the law and rejected faith in Jesus whereas the church says they have faith in Jesus but reject the law. Revelation 12:17, 14:12 and 22:14 says that believers have both (faith and obedience).

    My wife blessed me by saying that the Bible is a two-edged sword (TWO testaments). The Old Testament (which most people think of as keeping the law) says that obedience is better than sacrifice (1 Samuel 15:22) and the New Testamant (which most people equate only with faith) says that faith is dead without works. Abraham believed, therefore obeyed, and was justified (James 2).

    So I believe we have to obey the Bible in order for our faith in Jesus to be real, saving faith.

    I hope this answers your question.

    Tim C


  15. I have read the article and all the comments shown here. I have one question. Are you advocating abandoning church fellowship and worshiping at home on the Sabbath? The only church I am aware of that keeps the Sabbath is the Seventh Day Adventists or a Messianic Church if you can find one.
    The Adventists teach according to the Hope Channel on DTV that if you attend church on Sunday you are worshiping Satan. The also have a very weird teaching on the Tribulation and the and the Book of Revelation and hell.
    The messianic Jews i have met on Face Book are of two types. They are so deep into the Old Testament that they take hebrew hames and demand that everyone use their spelling of Yeshuah, which seems to change from one group to another, I would never find one that wasn’t condemning me to hell everyday for legalism.
    Where can I go?


  16. I am making the case that the 4th Commandment along with all other instructions from God are important and relevant in the life of anyone who claims to worship the God of Abraham. I am guessing that you agree with that, as your comment holds no objection. Your questions deals with implementation.

    A couple of comments for you to consider…First of all I am not a member of SDA. I am not sure they believe in keeping all of the Appointed Times of God…I do. Sabbath is but one. (Leviticus 23) I am just a Bible believing follower of Yeshua (Jesus the Christ). I believe as His disciple I should be imitating Him…He kept the 7th day Sabbath…if He did not we are in trouble as sin is defined Biblically as transgression of the Torah. (1John 3:4) While i know that I fail in many ways to live as Messiah does, He is my example to follow. Paul tells us that Messiah is the Goal of Torah for believers. (Romans 10:4)

    Second I do not abide in judging people who worship God on Sunday. What about Monday? What about wednesday night bible study? I was born again while in a Sunday worshiping church who loved the Lord and tried to teach the Word of God as they understood it. So I agree with you that is not right or good to condemn. While it is sad this occurs within the so called Messianic movement is does not define every group of people clinging to their faith in Messiah and the Word of God. Also, it does not hold that every group of Messianic believers are judgmental and legalistic in their approach to faith. While it may be the case in some instances…it is also true that some mainline protestant churches exhibit the same traits. Many a church has split over what kind of praise music they should have! Also, you might consider me to be quite messed up on my interpretation of Revelation! I don’t understand it all. All congregations are composed of flawed men and women. All congregations are faced with choices in how to walk out this walk we have been called to. Some may do a better job than others. But I will not get caught up in judging the love that someone has for the Lord based on a day of worship. I will however continue to point out that the Bible seems clear that we are to obey the 4th Commandment along with all of God’s instructions.

    That brings me to my final point in response to your comment. It does not matter what everyone else does. Do you believe that you should obey God when it comes to resting on and honoring the Seventh Day? Start there…Pray and ask God to lead you. Tell Him of your desire to be obedient and then act on that desire the best you can. See what happens. Let me know what happens. I pray right now that God would direct you in how you should proceed. Maybe this means staying where you are and showing others in love what you are seeing. Maybe this means starting a study on Sabbath and seeing what it turns into. May God Bless you as you follow Him. Contact me any time.

    In Messiah, Tim


  17. Tim T,

    What a beautiful response to the last writer! Thank you.

    My wife and I, too, are whole-hearted Bible believers and we constantly encourage everyone, everywhere we go, to know God’s voice as He instructs in 2 Timothy 2:15 and John 10:27.

    I ask people how they think they will hear the voice of Jesus when He calls us home at the end of time if we don’t recognize His voice, now. Most people at the baptism of Jesus thought they heard thunder but those who had ears to hear heard God say, “This is my Son…”

    Your last paragraph was exceptional. Start wherever you are to follow God in whatever He says and let that lead where it will. That’s a true follower of the WORD.

    Tim C


  18. Hello everybody!
    Yup, I’m a Messianic Jew who can’t wait for Passover to start! It’s hard going against the grain, and i admit I get stressed and anxious about it. Especially when the Lord tells me to get to work and I don’t know what He wants me to do.
    And yes, Paul does say for us to worship in the Sabbath. I Cor.16:
    Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given orders to the congregations of Galatia, so you must do also: Every first Sabbath let each one of you lay something aside, storing up as he may prosper, that there be no collections when i come.
    Toda!
    Viola


  19. Hello Tim

    I find it curious that you have until now ( more than a year later) not aw fit to reply to Moadeabe’s reply to your refutation. A pity, because, unlike your refutation of Misslers work, it brought many points to light. Facts, i believe are pertinent to the subject discussed. A succesfull refutation of Moadeades comments would certainly have swayed many in favor of your views. An absence, i’m afraid does the opposite.

    Truthseeker


    • I can appreciate your curiosity but must disagree with your conclusion. First of all, I hope you don’t take my silent response to some comments as an inability to do so. Sometimes I just choose to let something stand or fall on it’s own. As you must know, I could have chosen not to publish his or even your comments if I were somehow afraid or unable to respond Scripturally.

      I am also sorry that you as a truth seeker are unable to find any valid points being brought to light in my refutation. Thanks anyway for stopping by, Tim


  20. You have missed the entire point! What Paul teaches is that the Mosaic Law is now obsolete as a vehicle for saving men. Jesus is our New Torah/Law and to obey His commands and follow Him is what justifies us now! He is our Circumcision, Sabbath (“I will give you Rest), Sacrifice and Priest! We are under a NEW COVENANT now and the Old is no longer a means for saving anyone. “Let no man therefore judge you in respect of” the New Moon, Sabbath days etc…Notice that when God said he would make a NEW covenant, that it would NOT be according to the one He made with Israel under Moses. Love is now the fulfilling of the Law. It is not that the Mosaic Law wasn’t true and moral, but simply that it was never able to save any sinner since it could not impart righteousness to the sinner, and thus, the sinner could never live up to it in its entirety. Remember, IF you want to try and keep any part of the Law you must obey all of it 100%! To fail in even one point brought condemnation and made one as guilty as if he had broken it in its entirety. The Law was not made for a righteous man (believers) but for sinners, the unholy, the profane, etc…


    • I would like to issue you a challenge. Search my teachings and show me where I ever teach that the law is a vehicle for saving men. James, there is a difference between justification and obedience. I teach obedience to God’s Commandments and justification thru the saving faith that is found in Messiah Yeshua…Jesus the Christ. I pray that you can see the difference. I believe I teach what Paul taught. Let me know what you find. Tim


      • By the way James, I must ask…you said that “Jesus is our New Torah/Law”. Does He ever contradict His Father? Another question…can you tell me who the New Covenant is given to and does it do away with Torah or does it write the Torah on our hearts? Also, what is a Scriptural definition of love? (Consider 1 John 5:2-3) Finally, do you try to keep the Commandment not to steal? Then why not the fourth? Thanks for your comments and I look forward to your response. Tim


  21. I believe the 7th day adventists know what’s going on with nutrition but they seem to have sabbath on the brain. Its their explanation for everything it seems.

    E.G. White teaches the reason the Sethites could not interact with the Cannites was because the Cannites did not follow the Sabbath.

    Whats the Mark of the Beast? The Sabbath.

    The AntiChrist? The pope who forces us all to worship on Sunday. Again the Sabbath.

    Why do they consider themselves the true church on earth, The Sabbath!

    How the remaining followers of the Miller movement and the Great Dissapointment can start the 7th day church and then claim they are the one true church because they follow the true sabbath day is concerning to me.

    What is more concerning is White’s interpretation of who the Sons of God are and their multiple worlds concepts. This is very similar to the Mormans and Millers explaination for the Great Dissapointment seems very similar to the Jehovah Witnesses invisible Jesus story.

    We will soon know who is who after UFO Disclosure.

    E.G. Whites Sethite View will not hold up along with 90% of all the other churches concerning this view. In the wake of UFO Disclosure, the 7th day adventists will have no choice but to adopt the angel view or maybe they will welcome the Aliens like the mormons will.

    Once this happens everything else that White has written will be compromised like Miller was. According to White the whole planet is going to worship the pope as God on Sunday. Its ridiculous.

    Our children our being brainwashed right now into believing in Super Beings with Super Powers…..i.e..fallen angels/sons of God. Its all over the tv and movies now. If the 7th day adventists watched TV they could clearly see this pervassive good alien propaganda. Since the 7th day adventists believe in good sinless aliens from other worlds, this is not something they need to watch anyway.

    What do the 7th day adventists believe. They believe in multiple worlds with beings on them living without sin. What a wonderful introduction your church will be presenting to your sheep prior to the Fallen Angels and Sons of God return. Your right in line with the mormans on that one.

    President Obama personally addressed and praised the 7th day adventist and Hillary Clinton has a YouTube video sending her praises as well. Meanwhile, the obama administration sent the IRS to James Dobson to welcome the Evangelicals.

    Not that evangelicals are all that either. Most of them are stuck in the Sethite view too. The catholics changed its Angel view concerning Genesis 6:4 to the Sethite view over 500 yrs ago.

    Now what is the catholic church doing today. They claim aliens are all good now and have souls and everthing.

    I believe the deception of Matthew 24 is UFO Disclosure. It is the only thing that makes any sense. UFO disclosure could easily lead to a one world government, religion and currency.
    Some antichrist pope makes no sense at all. Maybe it did to E.G. White in the 1800’s but in a post Roswell world, its ridiculous.

    Will the seventh day adventists welcome UFO disclosure or will they adjust their interpretation of Genesis 6:4 to the Angel View. If they do the latter, off to the Fema Camps they go. No group will survive standing in the way of UFO Disclosure and NOT welcoming these interdimensional being. No one.

    I believe the one true church will rise from the ashes of all the other denominations and religions in the world. They will have no choice but to stand behind Chuck Missler and others who have warned us about this deception and the return of the nephillim.


    • Thanks for your opinions on SDA but you are a bit off topic. I am not a seventh day Adventist and know little of their beliefs that I might respond to you. I believe the Sabbath is the seventh day because God said so… Do you agree? Tim


  22. It is so simple, people! Gods Holy Law has always existed and either you obey Him or you don´t , it´s as simple as that!! Before there were any jew or gentile there was clean and unclean meats, sacrifices and instructions from God through either His direct communication with people or by sending Prophets. The reason the bible was codified was so that people wouldnt have an excuse to say they weren´t sinners and because Our God is a God of order and cannot tolerate Sin in any way, shape or form. Wake up, people.. Your saved through grace by Yeshuah´s blood and faith in Him as the Messiah, but if you do not want to obey His Father that made such a huge sacrifice to save us by obeying his Law, then what kind of faith do you show off? If we don´t have a Law from God to obey and to serve Him by, then we are our own judges and we ourselves define what is wrong and right, and that cannot be the case. Never has any true believer in the Scriptures walked in faith without obeying Him as well. Stop listening to pastors WHO deceives people by telling 85% truth but lie about the most important Things and thereby declare themselves false prophets!! *Think for yourselves and dont let others tickle your lazy way of believing, because if you truly love Our God YHWH, then you would love to obey what He says to obey! He cannot lie and doesnt change His Words, so why would you think His Son would!! Read what the Bible says and remember; The apostles only had the Torah and didnt have the NT in those days, so what do you suppose Paul and all the rest of them were preaching from!! Read your Bibles and let the Holy Spirit guide you instead of just walking after what others preach and just assuming their right, just because it suits you not to do anything and live in the oh im saved without having to do anything but proclaim Jesus name. If we didnt have a law in our country, people would be going wild if they all had to decide what was right and wrong. The same way Abba created everything and has set some rules which we are to abide by and if we dont, we sin against Him, by disregarding His Law. It wasnt Moses Law, but Gods Law given through Him, so stop deceiving yourselves. We are not allowed to kill or break any of the ten commandments, so why are you willing to break the 4´th by not honoring and keeping the Sabbath?? It is God´s feasts and not the jews feasts, they just got the privilege to keep them as the first chosen people of God, but now through Christ we are grafted into His people and there is no other Law than the Law He has given once and for all and by which everything created has to obey. Do you show your parents love by ignoring what they ask you to do, or do you prove your love and obedience by obeying them and honoring them as your parents??If human parents know how to punish their children for transgressing their rules, how much more right does Our Heavenly Father have to do so! Yes, He is loving and slow to anger and willing to forgive us, but not for delibirately transgressing His Laws, rules and regulations, not happening! The NT is the renewed and better covenant than the old because of Christ sacrifice, but it is founded on the same Divine Law, people. Our God doesnt change and His Son does only what He see´s His Father doing, so Yeshuah didn´t change anything but confirmed and fullfilled His Father´s will and showed us how to do it. If you love me, keep my commandments, which is His Father´s, because he didn´t do anything by himself but through His Father. WHO will he call lawless at his second coming?? Those WHO didnt obey His Fathers commandments, people! You may well be doing a lot of good deeds and such, but if you are not obeying Our Father´s commands, then you are not doing His will, it is as simple as that! Repent and return to Him for real and not only by lipservice and by assuming you know how to live a spiritfilled life. His Torah is likened to a lamp for us to guide us and instruct us in how to live in righteousness and how to please and love our Heavenly Father and our neighbour.Think about it!


  23. Please forgive me if I merely echo some points already made that I may have missed when reading comments, but I must concur with Mr. Missler on this issue and add some evidence to affirm his position.
    It is significant to me that the only day ever specifically mentioned in the New Testament for when believers met in fellowship was the “first day of the week,” either to “break bread” (Acts 20:7) or “concerning the collection for the saints” (I-Corinthians 16:2), implying in both cases that it was the regular day of worship.

    Additionally, when John received his visitation from the Lord in Revelation 1, he “was in the Spirit on the Lord’s Day” (v.10), not the Sabbath, again implying that it was the day of worship for the church and that the Sabbath was not in view anymore. It was a perfect place for God to affirm for us our continuing observation of the Sabbath, but He does no such thing, rather inspiring John to use the term, the Lord’s Day, which undoubtedly all believers used at that time in view of His reference to it as if it was common knowledge. This was not merely a tradition of men alone but rather was inspired by the Spirit of God.as evidenced by these scriptural affirmations.

    As was mentioned already above, the birth of the church in the Upper Room on Pentecost also is understood to have occurred on the first day of the week, the Lord’s Day (Sunday). But your remark about the event really being part of the onset of Monday by “Jewish reckoning” is not valid since the church was not part of the Jewish religion (Heb.10:19-20). In fact, in I-Corinthians 10:32 (KJV), Paul refers to the three existing groups of humanity as of Pentecost, “Jews, Gentiles, and the church of God”–the church being a separate body unto itself.

    Indeed, this issue didn’t exist for the church throughout the NT. Yes, you say that it was an OT commandment that is as binding as the other commandments. But if God, seeing the confusion over it down through the years, especially in view of how the overwhelming majority of the church has observed its day of worship as being on Sunday, as John also did, the Jerusalem Council in Acts 15 is the perfect place for Him to set the record straight for us. If we, who have been born again by His Spirit and love Him with all of our hearts, have been so deceived and amiss by not observing the Sabbath, surely the Council’s instructions in Acts 15:28-29, inspired by the Holy Spirit, would have made it clear to us and these many centuries of error could have been avoided. Those new believers, drawn out of the Gentiles at that time, had no knowledge of observing the Sabbath, and thus it is unthinkable that God would not have had such a commandment emphasized to them by the apostles. But we do not see it in their admonitions to them. There is no sense of urgency about it in any context in the NT, culminating in Romans 14, where it is again a perfect place for driving it home, but instead we see an attitude of latitude towards it that Paul employs.

    Finally, I believe that Hebrews 4 and 10 reveals how under the grace of the New covenant (Heb.10;9-10,16), the spiritual enablement of faithfully obeying the ten commandments is made a reality within our hearts, in contrast to those who stayed under the law, with only their self-justification in unbelief driving them on (Heb.4:2; Romans 9:31-32), leading to ultimate failure in truly obeying God with love (Heb.4:6; Rom.10:21). It is in this context that Hebrews 4:9-11 affirms that the Sabbath rest is accomplished in us by His Spirit and not by the OT means of an external ritual, which has no real power to achieve God’s rest in the sinful human heart, a rest which is the goal of His salvation.for His redeemed (Matthew 11:28-30)..


    • I am not sure what bible you are reading from, but keeping the Sabbath day Holy is a commandment of Yesuah God. and further one of the early popes [ people who unbelievably claim to be god/with the “power to forgive sins” ? google catholic canons and list of all popes ] commanded that the Sabbath be ignored; and that the 1st day of the week replace it and that failure to obey his [that papal edict] commandment would be punishable by excommunication and or death..read and understand who or what is behind the things you and missler attempt to belittle.


    • Thanks Dwight..sorry so slow to respond…

      I appreciate your input. If you don’t mind I would like to ask you a few questions one at a time concerning your comments so we don’t go onto rabbit trails as you threw out several things.

      First Question… Concerning John in the revealing of Messiah..and the fact it is often used as you are doing.. to attempt to justify disobedience to the fourth of God’s Commandments. Where in Scripture (chapter and verse) do we see that the Lord’s Day refers to Sunday? That would help me understand your position. I am sure you would agree it best to let Scripture interpret Scripture.

      I look forward to your answer but will share a thought ahead of time for you to consider. Could it not be possible that John was being witness to a prophetic vision of what was to occur on the “Day of The Lord” (Lords Day) with the day of the week being irrelevant?

      By the way I struggle with the relevancy of this as to the command to rest on the seventh day or is it just me?

      Thanks in advance. Tim


  24. Keith, sarcasm will get you nowhere. And I believe the scriptural content I provided makes it very clear that my effort was Biblically sound, content you made no effort to address in any way.

    Accounts of past Catholic anomalies are totally and utterly irrelevant. I showed you how the early church met on the first day of the week, John calling it “the Lord’s Day,” and Protestant churches of all varieties continued doing so following the Reformation.

    Also, Yeshua is the correct spelling of the Hebrew name of Jesus, who obviously did not issue the Sabbath commandment from Sinai, though yes, He is one with Father God who did. But we digress.

    You insist on its binding nature today because it was a commandment given to Israel, while Jesus said He “did not come to destroy the law” (Mat.5:17). But it was binding for Israel under the law and with all that went with it, Are you also keeping all the ceremonial commandments, etc., etc., that were likewise binding on Israel and which God tells us now He no longer has pleasure in, as they were “offered according to the law” (Heb.10:8)?

    Rather, the Lord now tells us jubilantly, “I will put my laws in their hearts” (Heb.10:16), through the saving faith He endows us with (Rom.12:3; Eph.2:8; Heb.12:2a; cf. II-Cor.3:3-5). And thus, we now have been “made sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life” (II-Cor.3:6).

    Consequently, “the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us” (Rom.8:4a) as we are “justified by faith apart from the deeds of the law” (Rom.3:28). Thus, keeping the Sabbath holy, as well as all of the law, is now represented and fulfilled in our new lives as new creations as we live out the “obedience of faith” (Rom.16:26b)..

    We must understand that the form of the old has passed away so that the new can be established for ensuring our sanctification and truly intimate relationship with God (Heb.10:9-10).
    But really, this worry and indignation over the actual outward form of keeping the Sabbath is futility. And Titus 3:9 is likely very appropriate for us to be mindful of at this point…


  25. All this “explaining away of Sabbath day observance” skips the glaring facts [2] that sunday among protestants and some others has replaced the Sabbath in a very HUGE way; in holiday keeping emphasis [sunday service, closed sunday ect.] and that a catholic pope declared the Sabbath null and void AND NOT to be kept…a pope? who is that to be cancelling the Sabbath? And of all days to be given big time emphasis why sunday and not the Sabbath? I await a reasonable explaination.


  26. That’s okay, Tim, life also has other concerns, I know, so no need to rush.
    I should start by saying that references to the “first day of the week” and the “Lord’s day” in scripture are not by themselves the heart of our conviction that a spiritual change has occurred in the practice of the church. But I believe it is an obvious indication of a change and, more importantly, a confirmation of the New covenant truth found in scripture which by the leading of the Holy Spirit has inspired a change in practice for the vast majority of the church from its very beginning. But just before looking at that truth again, may I answer your specific questions about the “Lord’s day” (“Day” in some translations).

    I would say first that the earlier mentions in the New Testament of the “first day of the week”–which is a Sunday–would appear to correspond to John’s usage of the term “Lord’s day” while he was “in the Spirit.” And to compare scripture with scripture, or to “let scripture interpret scripture,” if you will, indeed confirms this for us.
    The consistent meaning of being “in the Spirit” throughout the New Testament is always revealed as someone being in a state of worship and prayer. We see it in Ephesians 6:18–“pray at all times in the Spirit” and in Jude 1:20–“building yourselves up on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Spirit.” And those verses tie in with these: “I will pray with my spirit [by the Holy Spirit that is within me]” (I-Cor. 14:15/Amplified Version), and “those who worship Him must worship Him in spirit and truth” (John 4:24). In any event, the Biblical term “in the Spirit” is a very positive one, connoting a personal intimacy and communion with God which, in this case, is associated with the “Lord’s day” itself, an experience we all should be engaging in, especially when the church gathers together on its day of worship.

    However, to try somehow to tie the “Day of the Lord” in with the “Lord’s day” is incongruous to say the least. First of all, we can clearly see that John was already “in the Spirit” prior to the Lord’s visitation (Rev. 1:10), thus showing us that John’s situation in itself was unrelated to the vision he then received from God.

    And secondly, the “Day of the Lord” is consistently revealed to be a negative term throughout both Old and New Testaments, that is, a time of great woe, revealed as such in these OT passages: Joel 1:15; 2:11; 3:14; Isaiah 13:6,9; Amos 5:20; Ezekiel 30:3; and Obadiah 1:15; and in NT verses I-Thessalonians 5:2-3; II-Thes. 2:22, II-Peter 3:10 and Revelation 16:14. Moreover, Paul then makes it clear in the 4th verse of I-Thessalonians 5 that it is a time of woe in which Christ’s own redeemed will not be involved as those are who are unable to “escape” it in the 3rd verse. Clearly, these two Biblical terms are neither synonymous nor related, as you suggest.

    But other scripture reveals the correct doctrine here. Missler’s opponents affirm the outward keeping of the Sabbath by pointing to the fact that Jesus did it. And of course, He did, since the Old Covenant was still in effect. But they ignore the fact that this covenant ended when Jesus said on the cross that “it is finished” (John 19:30) as the “veil of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom” (Mat. 27:50-51). Paul makes it clear that Christ has “abolished in His flesh the enmity, that is, the law of commandments contained in ordinances” (Eph. 2:15; cf. Col. 2:14). In fact, Paul even speaks of the “ministry of death, written and engraved on stones” which, while being glorious, “was passing away” while the “ministry of the Spirit’ is “more glorious” (II-Cor. 3:7-8).

    Consequently, “the law was our tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor” (Galatians 3:24-25). And outwardly observing the Sabbath is part of that tutor under which we now do not live and have our being, for “the law is not of faith” (Gal. 3:12). But the OT form of the law, which was a shadow of the Christ to come (Heb. 10:1; Col. 3:11), is obviously no more, which explains why both Jesus and John referred to a “new” commandment of love (John 13:34: I-John 2:8). It is “faith working by love” that fulfills the law (Gal. 5:6b,14; cf. Mat. 22:40). Therefore, the old form or practice is replaced by new practices which celebrate realities about Christ Himself guided by His in-dwelling Spirit in His church (Gal. 5:18; 6:15).

    And so, by bragging about how you are so obedient to a commandment that was part of the Old Covenant’s system is a failure to rest from your own self-justifying works and is contrary to what Paul says to us: “For he who has entered His rest has himself also ceased from his works as God did from His” (Heb. 4:10). And if insisting on observing aspects of the law like circumcision or keeping sabbaths, then you are a “debtor to keep the whole law” (Gal. 5:3). Ultimately, Paul is led to write to “let no one judge you in food or in drink . . . or sabbaths, which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ” (Col. 2:16-17; emphasis mine).


    • Dwight…

      I appreciate very much your comments but must agree that indeed you are merely echoing some of the points made by Chuck Missler…points that I have addressed. Thats fine by the way but I may not address all of them again.

      I did feel you were unable to answer my question using Scripture. Also along the same lines… I think I heard you label the fourth commandment as ceremonial…again…I would challenge you in that this is a tradition of men…and an attempt to minimize and then disregard the fourth commandment and others. Scripture does not teach this.

      A few observations…feel free to correct me if I am wrong.

      It seems to me that you believe that the New covenant makes allowance to disregard God’s fourth commandment and others…I do not believe this is scriptural at all. If you read what Scripture says (Jeremiah 31:31) you will find….it is only given to the two houses of Israel….( just as the fourth commandment according to you) the Law will be kept (written on our hearts) and this covenant is not in full effect yet (all will know the Lord). So..why would we concern ourselves with something given only to Israel…is futuristic and finds his people keeping the Law? I think you know the answer…we are grafted in right? If you are in Christ….you ARE Abrahams seed!! (Galatians 3:29) Good news….now lets live like it!

      It also seems to me that you believe that the Holy Spirit will in some instances, lead people away from obedience (the fourth Commandment as one example) to our Father’s instructions…I do not. God does not change. If you or the “church” are being told by a spirit to disobey one of God’s eternal commandments you and the “church” are being deceived…something we are commanded not to be by the way. Dwight, walking in the spirit is walking in obedience to God. Walking in the flesh is walking in disobedience. (Romans 8:5-8) It’s a dangerous thing to confuse the two.

      You seem to believe that traditions of men ( the catholic church and all protestants who have followed) trump Commandments of God. I do not. Jesus warned us about laying aside the Commandments of God and instead holding to traditions of men. (Mark 7:8) And he warned us about teaching men what you and many others are teaching. (Matthew 5:19) This one verse should give you serious pause.

      Also, you seem to believe that Paul taught men to disobey God’s eternal Law…Yet this would make him a false prophet (Deut 13) Yet listen to his own words. Paul himself says “Do we, then abolish the law by this faith? Of course not! Instead we uphold the Law.” (Romans 3:31) Dwight, I would like to ask you to hear a warning from Peter concerning Paul ( 2 Peter 3:16-18) and reconsider your view of him. He Loved God and kept His Commandments.

      Finally, dont think the Sabbath and its blessings are not for you….just listen…

      Isaiah 56:4-7 4 For this is what the Lord says:

      “To the eunuchs who keep my Sabbaths,
      who choose what pleases me
      and hold fast to my covenant—
      5 to them I will give within my temple and its walls
      a memorial and a name
      better than sons and daughters;
      I will give them an everlasting name
      that will endure forever.
      6 And foreigners who bind themselves to the Lord
      to minister to him,
      to love the name of the Lord,
      and to be his servants,
      all who keep the Sabbath without desecrating it
      and who hold fast to my covenant—

      7 these I will bring to my holy mountain
      and give them joy in my house of prayer.
      Their burnt offerings and sacrifices
      will be accepted on my altar;
      for my house will be called
      a house of prayer for all nations.”

      Tim


  27. Hebrews 4 For we who have believed enter that rest, as he has said,…..

    Just so you know unbelief in Christ IS disobedience. Hebrews 3. Sabbath keeping IS faith in Christ not which day you worship. We worship in spirit and truth.

    Deut 4:13 the ten commandments(Mosaic covenant) are that very law, Romans 7 says we are dead to. Paul even uses one of the ten commandments(coveting) to show that’s the law we are dead to. Second of all the key about what Christ said was HE CAME TO FULFILL THE LAW. Which he did. Perfectly. Secondly(can’t give verse number but it’s in Romans 6, WE ARE NOT UNDER THE LAW, WE ARE UNDER GRACE.

    So as you interpret how to keep God’s commands(1 John 3:24) read it in context of Verse 23. This is his command. Believe in his son and love one another.

    The law was given to increase sin and for knowledge of sin.

    Sunday worship is in no way a Catholic start up. 4 Gospels. All four Say it was the first day he was raised. Next 1 Cor 15:14(maybe 17) says if Christ is not raised your faith is in vain. So Sunday corporate worship seems a little more spot on since law was a type and shadow yet the substance belongs to Christ. We worship in spirit and truth. Not the letter of the law, which was written, on stone and obviously paper. The law of the spirit is written on our hearts.

    The law goes together as a whole. Not ceremonial so we don’t need that(Christ is actually performing these duties in heaven as we speak intervening for us the way OT priests did) morally we are called to do those things there is no law against Gal 5:22, and civil, well God has given Governments the sword(in Romans 13 I think maybe 12) meaning the law goes together as a whole(read James) we don’t get to break it up.

    Next we are not under the law but under grace(Romans 6 I think) and we have died to the law(including the ten.) Romans 7

    No I don’t agree with Chuck Missler but you are no better, you who would be justified by the law, after hearing the gospel have fallen from grace. Read Galatians. In Romans 10, starting verse 4, you see two different righteousness. One is of the law, and one by faith. Which one you think God is pleased with in light of Romans 3:20?

    Those who say to me lord lord, are those who thought their works while adding Christ would get them in(scripture Matt). Christ is the END of the law for all who believe(scripture). Only do not use your freedom to satisfy the lusts of the flesh but to love one another and share in each other’s burdens thereby fulfilling the law of CHRIST(scripture).

    You are saved by grace, through faith. And this Not of yourselves is a gift from God so no man can boast. Eph 2

    Please learn what scripture really says about how we keep the law. Sabbatarians by definition make keeping the Sabbath ceremonial. Jesus in John 7, talking about the Sabbath again told them Moses gave them the law yet none of them kept the law. Why are you trying to kill me He says.

    You say you don’t kill but even hating is considered murder by scripture. You have been taught falsely about your own goodness and been given a twisted interpretation of scripture.

    Plainly it says we are dead to the law(10 commandments included) in Romans 7. It also says we are not under the law but under grace. Sorry acting like a Pharisee, I tithe this much, I never miss a bible study, check list Christianity doesn’t prove your a Christian. Its our love for one another, and a life marked by repentance. True spiritual growth means you see the cross getting bigger everyday. Not as smaller. Meaning the closer you get to Christ the clearer you sinfulness becomes while being cleaned of it. Sanctification isn’t a process. You are either saved or you aren’t. You are either set apart by God(Romans 9, yes it means God picks and chooses read Galatians 3 to see Romans 9 is actually talking about Salvation not nations.) or you are not.


    • A few points…I NEVER claim to be good. I never claim to be justified by law. I do however teach and will continue to teach that we should obey God. I am very concerned about the number of professing Christians who teach lawlessness while claiming to follow the One who kept His Fathers instructions perfectly. It makes no sense. Yet…this is the world in which we live. We should obey God…not to be saved but because we are. I can guarantee you that Jesus never would teach disobedience to His Father’s instructions…neither will I. It’s a dangerous place to be. Tim


  28. I will pray for you, brother. for someone to spend so much time to openly refute another brother does not show much maturity in Christ. Disputes among the body only show the give those outside the church more to speak out about. The body is one and is not to be divided. Even Augustine is attributed with the saying: In Essentials Unity, In Non-Essentials Liberty, In All Things Agape.

    I pray that Our Father opens your eyes to Agape, and that the spirit be your teacher.


  29. Hi there. I see that this is an old article that is still getting a lot of much deserved attention over the years since it was published.

    I hope you’ll have the patience to respond to my comment as well. I am a long time Sunday christian (in fact from childhood) and was recently acquainted with Messianic Judaism and the Sabbath question when I heard of Jonathan Cahn and Mark Biltz teaching the shemitah (sabbatical years) and the blood moons.

    It made me realize that – if Cahn is correct then God does indeed take his sabbaths (sabbatical years and Jubillee) seriously. If He will take the shemitah seriously then He will certainly take the 7th day seriously. For the first time in my life I was met with such a profound dilemma that I thought I could resolve by a simple study of the Word (and whatever historical information I could find). I’ve read the commentaries from all the teachers that I respect and look up to (including John Macarthur and Chuck Missler) and to be honest both sides of the argument sound convincing. Both sides are able to dig up scriptural basis for their opinion.

    I was a fool for ever thinking that I could shortly resolve an issue that has been discussed for hundreds – thousands? of years. I cannot hope to even put myself in the same level as these men of God and esteemed teachers. I can only read what I can diligently and with the help of conscience, make a decision.

    While I’m figuring these things out I need help on the following. I have emailed several bloggers about this but have not heard a convincing answer (or received an answer at all).

    I’d like your thoughts please on how to observe the Sabbath. If I decide to observe the 7th day what can we do or not do? Cooking food? Small tidying up? Going to the beach on a birthday that falls on a sabbath, switching on the TV, checking or sending an email?? Can you give a list of practical dos and don’ts? If I pick up the broom on the sabbath do I damn myself to hell? If I don’t join a messianic congregation and stick to my Sunday church for whatever reason, am I putting myself in the way of judgment? (I am not being facetious – I am just a practical person). If I join the Saturday Toastmaster’s meets with the sole desire to preach the gospel in the required speeches, is that a sin or not? If I take my family out to lunch and pay for that lunch in an establishment? What should a christian (who is not living in Israel and is living in a society where Friday or Sunday is instituted as a sabbath) do and not do on the 7th day?

    I do look forward to your earnest reply. God bless you.


  30. if you will do a CAREFUL research, you will find out that it’s not the Roman Catholic church who promoted Sunday worship. Dig in some works of Josephus and you’ll know. 🙂


  31. Yeshua would treat you just like He did the pharisee and the sadducee, because your ear does not hear, neither your eye see, will speak to you in parables.
    Have been studying the Bible via Dr Chuck Missler, a very diligent and humble man, and what i see here, against this careful servant, is condemnation without investigation.
    Upon many hours of commentary, Dr Chuck always instructs us to do our homework and be like the Berean Acts 17:11, These were more fair minded than those in Thessalonica in that they received the word with all readiness and searched the scriptures daily to find out whether these things were so.
    He also points out countless times, when stating a conjecture or idea, that he is making a suggestion, that it is not necessarily correct, and that we do our own study on it if we don’t agree,
    Many times I have done this and even though there are many opinions and conjectures coming from so called experts etc, I find when concluded and discovered he may be correct.
    His diligence on bringing Historic evidence with his teaching, to me is brilliant considering we were kept blind from the truth through the School system, and I am not just talking about Geographical here, I mean political, law, justice,the social and civic, genealogy, hey even creation itself, so Chuck does what I have seen no other do, course I don’t blame you, I applaud you, because Yeshua is using him, to cause people like you to react.
    It is inspiring to see you have gone out of your way to refute the man, and rightly so, gathering you are misinformed and have lack of knowledge, prior to Chucks teaching of the Great Architect Of All Creation, Father God, as Chuck reminds us often, I am convinced here is an anointed and appointed Disciple that has enhanced my understanding and knowledge of who the truth is YESHUA after all that is Who Chuck always exalts.
    Like me, get down on your knees, and ask the Maker of the universe, The Great I Am, The Almighty God, to humble you, teach you,train you, discipline you, and equip you, and get you ready for what is coming, we are all responsible, and will be without excuse.

    Trust me Its not Chuck Missler you need to be worried about
    its who is whispering in your ear.

    God Bless


  32. the 10 Commandments are very simple basic Commandments that GOD gave Moses and that JESUS kept and did teach. and the LORD [unlike some catholic heads of their religion] NEVER decreed ,commanded or removed that one pertaining to the 7th day which is called Saturday. A simple commandment. However he did make a big deal about keeping it free from gainful work etc. and to keeping it holy unto the Lord; because HE rested on the 7th day, he wants us to do and observe the same. And especially neither did he tell everybody to start going to church AND making a big deal about the first day of the week which is sunday, [and for that matter easter eggs, rabbits,HEAVILY decorated trees with baals on them yule logs, a drummer boy in the manger, trans gender rights?? and on and on] read and study the religions that DID seek [successfully, for some people ] to change the Lords Sabbath day.



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